So what is a good test and review [Archive] - British Blades

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JMS

11-10-03, 09:09 AM

Dave Barker

13-10-03, 06:38 AM

JEan Marc....

I don't know if you read the long thread right at the beginning of the forum.. DON*T ASK THIS QUESTION... I remember things got heated last time ( Admittedly I was a little hot under the colar too SORRY :rolleyes: )

To the moderaters here well, i'm saying nothing ( for once!!) but me thinks the proverbial can of worms is opened.....again..

I'n going to have fun reading this one!!

Tony

13-10-03, 10:50 AM

I'd like to hear your thoughts about what is a good review.

Review does not mean much in itself, because you can pick a blade, look at it and say you do not like the color, and call that a review.

Testing does not mean much either, you can play the Cliff Stamp and destroy a blade, and rate it using a pseudo-scientific jargon and procedures, (still nobody knows if it is a good knife), or you can simply USE it for some time and rate your findings.

Personally, I find the Stamp style ultimately boring, and do not see a need to be too scientific.

I like reviews of this kind:
http://outdoors.free.fr/s_article.php?id_article=115 (single review)
http://outdoors.free.fr/s_article.php?id_article=10 (comparison)

I think that a good review must be a pleasure to read, wether it is positive or negative. I also think that the best way to evaluate a blade is to compare it to one or a set of permanent reference blades. As for negative reviews, well, what's the point to publish them ?

So I'd like to hear Martyn and Tony point of view on this. (and any other of course).

Both well put together reviews and the format is really good. Right along the lines of what I would like the reviews to be. As for only putting up good reviews that's how you like to do it which is fine. I agree that there is no point putting up really crap knives which is why we are going to be really careful about what we review. But if is supposed to do the job and it does not then why should people not know about it, or at least it is inferior to other knives. They may just presume that it has not been tested go and buy one and waste their hard earned dosh, which could have paid for something better. For them to be helped out in their choices of kit they need to have a bigger picture than just the ones that are great. IMHO

We all want the reviews to be a pleasure to read, the trouble is that is such an individual experience, some of the chaps on here probably get bored unless the technical info proliferates the whole document, others just want to know if it is tough and what you did with it to prove it is as tough as you say. We will endeavour to give a good, well rounded review that will be in two linked sections that cover a lot of info. If you don't like the technical stuff just read the field test and vice versa. A lot of people will read the whole lot though.

We can only get on with it and take on board any comments made and hopefully end up with something that works for the majority.

You have some excellent reviews on your site and I will be looking for inspiration, I know there is some there :D

MushiSushi

13-10-03, 11:01 AM

I'd like to hear your thoughts about what is a good review.

Review does not mean much in itself, because you can pick a blade, look at it and say you do not like the color, and call that a review.

Testing does not mean much either, you can play the Cliff Stamp and destroy a blade, and rate it using a pseudo-scientific jargon and procedures,
:lmao: ;) ..... I have heard it remarked many a time that his scientific descriptions leave a pseudo ring to them, I have heard it said that he is deliberately setting out to be confrontational with some people in the way that he describes and tests some knives, I have heard that he is highly prejudiced in his appraisals and I have heard that his tests don't always take in to consideration the intended use of the knives yet slams them for failing the test. I have heard all these things, but i, on the other hand, have no comment. ;)

I think that a good review must be a pleasure to read, wether it is positive or negative. I also think that the best way to evaluate a blade is to compare it to one or a set of permanent reference blades. As for negative reviews, well, what's the point to publish them ?
Agreed with the first bit and negativity can be a pleasure to read if it's done with constructive criticism, because there is something to learn from it. As to publishing negative reviews, well, we are in the business of being both consumers and makers here, we can take that negativity and learn from it, or we can discard it as not applicable to our needs, that's our choice, the review puts the information out there and we can choose to accept it or not. I think it's down to the nature and motive of the review, as long as it's constructive, it's a good review. Once it starts bringing in prejudices outside of the item, that's when things start getting destructive.

So I'd like to hear Martyn and Tony point of view on this. (and any other of course).
I hope you don't mind me putting my bit in too? ;)

JMS

13-10-03, 11:57 AM

Thanks guys,

Well, yes, constructive criticism is great, on the other side, I have tested a few times total failures, and I did think they somehow were not worth any ink or effort to talk about it. ;)

The thing also you often read is to be objective, but actually there is no such thing as objectivity IMHO when talking about tools. Some will like the 7" blade, some will prefer the hollow ground, some the convex, some the scandinavian grinds... Some expect a knife with a guard some without, some like carbon, some like stainless...

A step further than making reviews which are indeed partial, and may not fit anybody. I think the non expert user would benefit more of guidance. ?? I remember when I was reading rock album reviews, I never liked the ones that were emphasized. Same for knives, how many did I buy, because someone found it great, and I found it crap? You may however get better results by having multiple testers....

Mushi, Happy you jump in ;)

The General

13-10-03, 04:52 PM

I think it is fair to say that we are doing something different.

Tony will take care of how a knife performs in the real field of bushcraft in some detail. How easy to maintain, use and sharpen etc. In the field.

I will take care of the opening box's, kitchen use, technical specs, special collectors features and the other things that turn on the collector rather than the hard core user.

With care we will thus get a general overview of the history of the knife, the type and what part of the market it is aimed at, in short what is so special about this knife from the light user and collectors point of view. I can be as technical or as light as required! I can promise you I have no interest in Stampian levels of excell mumbo jumbo!

After this introduction, Tony will take her out for a test and we will have a package that ought to be fun to read, informing to both collectors and bush users without a bias to either point of view! The reviews will not pull any punches as to go easy would be an insult to paying members who will read the reviews. However each and every knife will be used in the manner clearly intended and not abused to the point of failure! I enjoy the infamous hotdog tin test and a rough use emergency test, but hey I do this with MY KNIVES that I have bought!

I think this will be an unique dual interest review system that will be great fun to co-moderate. I just hope Tony does not mind having me on a couple of his courses at some point! I am as eager to learn as anyone! :biggthump

As I learnt at Uni, if after the first three paragraphs your attention has not been gained, something has failed. Fun does not have to read lacking in substance.

Tony

13-10-03, 06:20 PM

I think that in some ways we are fairly safe because our (bcuk) perspective is bushcraft use, not military, not pure hunting etc. Thus we can say that it works or does not work in that setting. I agree that we should have a standard to compare against, which will probably be the woodlore knife which is a fantastic knife.

So, it seems quite straight forward for me. IF we do come across some really naff knives we will have to ask ourselves if we should have known they would not be up to the mark, if we should then maybe it's not right to publish the review. On the other hand if the knife should have performed well, or was sold as the next best thing since sliced bread we need to let our readers know that they should look out. People are going to use us for advice on what is good and what is not, if something is being sold as good for the industry (bushcraft) we need to know if it is, or not. I think it is worse that someone may go and spend loads of dosh on something inappropriate when they could have had a helping hand.

It's a bit like the film reviews - Barry Norman says it's great, really funny, but it was a bit long. Because I have got used to his tastes in films I can judge that I will also find it funny but I won't find it too long because he says that about everything over 90 minute and I can sit there for 180 minutes. His statement in itself is a guide and I do not have to agree with everything he says for him to help me know what I will like and not like.

Does that make sense :D

JMS

13-10-03, 08:45 PM

Well, Yes, all of that is fine, but it treats of what you are going to do. The official bushcraft UK/British blades reviews. It is fine, you do them as you wish, the same way I will choose my authors on my site, no problem.

But let's try not to narrow the subject on a project, but check on existing stuff, and criticize it. I see here is a "Testing and reviews" forum, which must have some use, or design, because I think that "Official reviews" or tests or whatever you call them are more prone to articles than forum discussions, am I right ?

So whatever solution you choose as "The solution" for official British blades and bushcraft UK is not really my question, though I am pretty sure you'll do something fine.

What I have trouble understanding yet, is what's the purpose of this forum, as it seems your test and reviews follow really greater design than a forum. But all discussions seem to come back to the Bushcraft UK/BB revues (to which I wish success), which is far from my question.

Ho well I must have been and still be missing something somewhere.

Tony

13-10-03, 10:18 PM

I may not have understood you correctly, but :D
For me the reviews will go up on bcuk as reviews in the reviews section, which is basically an article. On BB there is only the forum to work with and the whole review idea has to be trialed and worked with to get it to work in this environment. It has to start somewhere and this seemed the best place. The reviews themselves will not be open for discussion with an eye to any changes or justification, although they can be discussed by the members as any review would be. If it were not narrowed down into a niche area it would be too huge to manage. However, I am sure that if this is successful it will set the precedent for expansion of the reviews.

Martyn

13-10-03, 10:43 PM

Jean Marc, perhaps I can shed some light on this.

You are right, the reviews we have in mind are better suited to a web article than forum - and that's exactly what they will be. On Tony's site, they will be articles immediately. But here, we dont as yet have webpages, just the forum - the web pages will follow. So in the interim, the reviews will be on here, in the form of a closed, sticky thread that will later be transfered to the web pages.

But the purpose of this forum, is not just to offer a temporary home to articles which should appear on web pages, but also a place where members can write their own comprehensive reviews if they wish. If they are good, they may find their way onto a web page. It's a great place for budding review writers to flex their muscles. I'm not just talking about "this is great - go buy one", but something more critical and in-depth. You're free to write your own and post em in here. Wayne and Tone will proof read em and judge whether they should stay (they dont have to achieve any particular standard, but they do need to be more that a quick praise-up).

HTH.

JMS

17-10-03, 11:14 AM

Fine, Martyn, that was the clarification I was looking for.

chad234

25-10-03, 04:48 AM

JM,

I'd say the two reviews listed are decent.