PDA

View Full Version : Vintage Sheffield folder's (pic heavy !)



Pages : 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17

dkonopinski
13-09-08, 08:28 AM
Got lots of knives to post soon (some good ones). Will get round to it eventually.

How is everyone?

Andy

Looking forward to seeing your knives, Andy.

David

RodgersLad
13-09-08, 02:26 PM
Time for the oldies.

Two blade shell knife. Dates to around 1825-1830, no star and cross marks necessary at that time.

Really lovely knife. These very early ones are easy to spot, the blades have a special look to them and the patterns are ones that weren't usually carried on into the 1900's.

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/5859/sarah502vj0.jpg

RodgersLad
13-09-08, 02:29 PM
William the fourth 1830-1837 combination letter opener and blade. MOP and in great condition for age.

Hard to get a picture of the marks but it says W crown R RODGERS CUTLERS TO THEIR MAJESTIES PATENT.

http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/2944/sarah503ct4.jpg

http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/907/sarah504eu2.jpg

dkonopinski
13-09-08, 03:43 PM
The letter opener knife is really interesting. Mechanised envelope manufacture didn't happen until the mid 19C so this will have been used to lift wax seals and open hand made envelopes.

The shell knife is just lovely and in such good condition too.

Could we have some basic dimensions please?

Thanks Andy.

David

RodgersLad
13-09-08, 03:48 PM
Victorian ladies scissor knife, looks to be unused.

2 blades, scissors, perfume screw, button hook

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/8315/sarah512fq5.jpg

Really lovely little thing. Set on 3 springs.

RodgersLad
13-09-08, 03:52 PM
The letter opener knife is really interesting. Mechanised envelope manufacture didn't happen until the mid 19C so this will have been used to lift wax seals and open hand made envelopes.

The shell knife is just lovely and in such good condition too.

Could we have some basic dimensions please?

Thanks Andy.

David

David, thanks for that info as i'm no expert on those. It came from a very old sewing box so my guess is it had hardly been used if atall. To be that old and in such condition, it must have been kept somewhere safe for a very long time.

The shell knife measures 3" open and 1.5" closed. I will take a look at the opener next time as its gone away now,

glad you like them

Andy

RodgersLad
13-09-08, 04:06 PM
It needs a clean but i just have to show this.

VERY rare 2 blade knife with "Pelletts patent" mark. No nail nicks, i think the buttons on the top were simply to aid in opening the blades.

Shell scales (those poor turtles) and nickel silver buttons. Circa 1910

http://img160.imageshack.us/img160/2185/sarah505nt5.jpg

Gareth
13-09-08, 04:37 PM
Victorian ladies scissor knife, looks to be unused.

2 blades, scissors, perfume screw, button hook

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/8315/sarah512fq5.jpg

Really lovely little thing. Set on 3 springs.

Love that. I thought it seemed a bit of an odd place for a corkscrew until I read your post. :baghead

sebago
13-09-08, 04:39 PM
Hi Andy,

We occasionally see those Pellett's Patent knives over here at the knife shows. They were not used exclusively by Rodgers, as we have owned a few with other stampings that were quite correct. The notches in the handles being a dead giveaway, plus, of course, the lack of a nail mark. Incidentally, the patent was granted to W.W. Pellett, in 1893.

Jim Taylor.

RodgersLad
13-09-08, 04:44 PM
Gareth, you are right, that would be a strange place for a corkscrew : )

Thanks for the info Jim, i thought the patent would be used on other knife manufacturers too. Was W.W.Pellett an English man then? Any other info about him or what he did?

thanks

Andy

sebago
13-09-08, 05:21 PM
Hi Andy,

Yes, W.W.Pellett was an Englishman. All that I have is a page from a book that is entited; "Abridgment Class Cutlery" This must have been a gigantic book, as the page number is 1892. My guess would be the British Patent Register?

Under the heading; 5613. (patent number?) I quote:

"Pellett, W.W. March 22.
pocket knives and instruments similarly mounted to shut up into handles are provided with ears (a) insted of the usual nick to facilitate opening."

This is accompanied by a line drawing of a two bladed folder with the Pellett's patent "ears" that are marked in the drawing (a)

If you have any means of looking up that patent number, then I'm sure you would find chapter and verse on Mr. Pellett!

The year 1893, is quoted in Levine's Guide IV.

Jim Taylor.

RodgersLad
13-09-08, 08:36 PM
Thanks for all that info Jim, i need to print that off.

Andy

wellington03
13-09-08, 08:59 PM
Andy

I can't really add much to what has already been said, the two very early knives the two blade and the letter opener look in remarkable condition. The Victorian ladies knife looks quality and the Pelletts patent knife interesting, I have had Pellett knives made by J Rodgers G Wostenholm and Needham Bros (Repeat) I think they were very popular in late Vic and Edwardian times.

Great knives, thanks for showing

Mick :)

RodgersLad
13-09-08, 09:01 PM
MOP, 4 blade congress?

One of the blades marked tobacco blade. Circa 1915.

http://img92.imageshack.us/img92/2020/img0746ja9.jpg

http://img75.imageshack.us/img75/5125/img0745cm7.jpg

wellington03
13-09-08, 09:10 PM
Nice pearl example Andy, all Congress knives usually have the sheepfoot master blade as yours has, great curved pen blades !. Made for export to the US ?.

Thanks for showing

Mick:)

RodgersLad
13-09-08, 09:13 PM
Mick, yes i bought this from America, well spotted! I am impressed : )

Like you said, the curve of the pen blades is nice - when the others are closed, it makes it look even more impressive.

Andy

dkonopinski
14-09-08, 09:03 AM
Fantastic stuff here. Loads of interesting info plus the first curved pen blades I've ever seen. Thanks fellas.

David

RodgersLad
14-09-08, 11:42 AM
This is a very recent one i have. Anyone know what an "office knife" was. I have seen them by a few makers. I was attracted to this one as i liked the scrolled text.

http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/8617/sarah520eb8.jpg

RodgersLad
14-09-08, 11:46 AM
This is another new knife that i am VERY impressed with. Victorian and in lovely condition. Made by J.Nowill, anyone know anything about thsi maker? When were they trading? Were they a good maker? Were they just knife manufacturers? Where was their factory?

http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/6238/sarah518qv2.jpg

http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/7633/sarah519pp4.jpg



Thanks everyone,

Andy

dkonopinski
14-09-08, 12:10 PM
Lovely Nowill, Andy. John Nowill & Sons was a Sheffield maker who first appeared in records around 1700 and lasted into the 1950's. Family firm all the way through to 1949 when they were bought by F E & J R Hopkinson and moved from Scotland Street to London Road. Earlier in their history they were at a few other addresses. - See Tweedale p 242.

Russell White
14-09-08, 02:53 PM
:) does anyone know anything about this knife, my dad found it in 1956 while doing his paper round and my nan took it off him and it turned up again after my nans death. i think tang stamp is thos.turnerhttp://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii191/russwh_2008/HPIM2428.jpg http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii191/russwh_2008/HPIM2427.jpg

RodgersLad
14-09-08, 03:27 PM
Solid silver, hallmarked for 1946.

Made by thomas turner who were once cutlers to royalty so its a well respected brand. Looks to be in good condition and the blades look like they might be stainless steel.

If you are interested in value, i'd say about 20.

Russell White
14-09-08, 03:30 PM
thanks r.l.:D

Berkley
14-09-08, 05:00 PM
Andy,
According to Levine's Guide to Knives, an "Office Knife" is a relatively large equal-end pen knife that has a spear master blade for opening letters and a spey-type blade to serve as an ink eraser. Office knives have white handles - celluloid, bone or ivory - with OFFICE KNIFE in fancy letters. "An office knife is a working knife for a clerical worker."
Certainly much nicer than the usual run of modern office supplies.:)
Berkley

RodgersLad
14-09-08, 05:15 PM
Thanks Berkley.

Yes it is larger than i expected it would be and i think the handle is celluloid. I really like myn.

Great info,

Andy

Yorkshireman
14-09-08, 06:17 PM
i think the handle is celluloid.


It is Grained Xylonite, a cellulose nitrate based material (like smokeless gunpowder!). The graining was supposed to give an ivory-like appearance.

wellington03
14-09-08, 07:04 PM
It is Grained Xylonite, a cellulose nitrate based material (like smokeless gunpowder!). The graining was supposed to give an ivory-like appearance.

Yep agree the little office knife looks like it has xylo scales. Xylonite was the first of many types of imitation ivory, it was introduced around 1875, soft and flexible easy to work with, but it was extremely flammable and heaps of shavings in particular caused many fires

Andy the 5 pc J.Nowill and sons knife looks a great item, I like its long sabre clip master blade.

Thanks for showing

Mick :)

dkonopinski
16-09-08, 10:19 AM
Not one I own, but something floating across the bay. A pattern like no other I've seen from Rodgers or anyone else for that matter. I leave it to you experts to throw any light you can.

Here
(http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VINTAGE-MULTI-FUNCTION-POCKET-KNIFE-JOSEPH-RODGERS_W0QQitemZ320295995172QQcmdZViewItem?hash=i tem320295995172&_trkparms=72%3A12|39%3A1|66%3A2|65%3A12|240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14)

Cheers

David

sebago
16-09-08, 12:59 PM
David,

That's a Yachtsman's knife. I believe that they are still made today by the Egginton Group?

Jim Taylor.

wellington03
16-09-08, 01:46 PM
David,

That's a Yachtsman's knife. I believe that they are still made today by the Egginton Group?

Jim Taylor.

Interesting knife David !, Thanks for the info Jim.


Just like to show this pruner

Wheatley Brothers. Sheffield Medium Pruner 3 3/4" circa 1930s ?.

This knife has a large flat ground pruning blade etched/stamped "Wheat Sheaf knife", it has iron liners pins and rattail bolsters. And a brass seal end cap. Square tang. The scales are man made.

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/88d08555.jpghttp://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/2c7ebcd5.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/1148c605.jpg

Thanks for looking

Mick

dkonopinski
16-09-08, 02:08 PM
David,

That's a Yachtsman's knife. I believe that they are still made today by the Egginton Group?

Jim Taylor.

Thanks for the info, Jim. What's the hole in the handle used for, or is it just to reduce the weight?

David

PS Aha! It's a shackle key! All I gotta do now is find out what a shackle is on a yacht. Google....google...google...

PPS Aha! So there's a few different shapes of shackle. Cor, the stuff you can learn on BB. Splice the main thingy & shiver me wossnames.

wellington03
16-09-08, 03:23 PM
A new member would like to see a true split spring whittler, so I have taken better pics of a fine, but heavily cleaned knife featured on pg 1 of this thread.

Well worth a closer look

James V(crownR) Machin. Sheffield 5 1/2" Lockback (true split spring)Whittler, Circa 1840 41/4" sheepfoot ? masterblade, the bottom blades are a coping and up swept pen. It has fancy brass liners scalloped on both sides and matching (perfect) carved ivory scales. The back spring has been split part way.

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/sm/fd6795b3.jpghttp://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/sm/ecdbe6c6.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/sm/f69d77a0.jpghttp://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/sm/13044835.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/sm/3ab65ad1.jpghttp://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/sm/9073ecb5.jpg

Mick :)

Blade Runner
16-09-08, 04:18 PM
Thanks Mick, I'm speechless. Beautiful knife and geat pics. Any more split spings?
B-R

dkonopinski
16-09-08, 04:43 PM
Thanks Mick, I'm speechless. Beautiful knife and geat pics. Any more split spings?
B-R

I've one or two, but new US & China not old Sheffield.:)

wellington03
16-09-08, 05:26 PM
Thanks Mick, I'm speechless. Beautiful knife and geat pics. Any more split spings?
B-R

Pleased you like the Machin B-R, it has a lot of good points, but it has suffered from being cleaned on a wragg dolly, pity !

I have seen a several split spring whittlers, over the past few years, usually older made before 1850.

Mick :)

Blade Runner
16-09-08, 05:51 PM
Mick I've seen a hand full in the last 25 years here and even a couple of split spring jack knives, but they are super rare. I think it is better to leave these old knives with their original patina, but that Machin is real eye candy none the less. Thanks for showing her!
B-R

Blade Runner
16-09-08, 06:03 PM
I've one or two, but new US & China not old Sheffield.:)

Hi dkonopinski, :lol: Maybe we'd better do that one in another thread
B-R

wellington03
16-09-08, 06:17 PM
I've one or two, but new US & China not old Sheffield.:)

Sound like great knives David http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/sm/8f172370.gif

Mick:D

dkonopinski
16-09-08, 06:24 PM
Hi dkonopinski, :lol: Maybe we'd better do that one in another thread
B-R

Well, I'm travellng this week so although I'll be on-line some of the time, I can't do pics until the weekend, if I'm lucky. Then I'll post them in a Split Spring thread.

David

Blade Runner
16-09-08, 06:34 PM
Well, I'm travellng this week so although I'll be on-line some of the time, I can't do pics until the weekend, if I'm lucky. Then I'll post them in a Split Spring thread.

David

Thanks my friend that sounds good!!

RodgersLad
17-09-08, 12:43 PM
Whats a split spring whittler?

I might have some, not sure.

Andy

Blade Runner
17-09-08, 02:01 PM
Whats a split spring whittler?

I might have some, not sure.

Andy

Hi Andy,

Most modern Whittlers have two back springs separated part of the way down the length with a spacer, the two small blades on one end ride on their own spring. The master blade on the other end is very thick and bears on both springs(Many times these are called split spring whittlers, but this is a misnomer). A true split spring whittler has one spring that is actually split on one end. These seem to be a very old design and you can see a good picture of one in Mick's post above. BTW I have also seen Jack knives with split springs.
B-R

dkonopinski
17-09-08, 03:54 PM
Hi Andy,

Most modern Whittlers have two back springs separated part of the way down the length with a spacer, the two small blades on one end ride on their own spring. The master blade on the other end is very thick and bears on both springs(Many times these are called split spring whittlers, but this is a misnomer). A true split spring whittler has one spring that is actually split on one end. These seem to be a very old design and you can see a good picture of one in Mick's post above. BTW I have also seen Jack knives with split springs.
B-R

That being the case, what I've got is not a true split spring whittler. I'll post it anyway at the weekend as it's interesting.

David

Blade Runner
17-09-08, 04:57 PM
That being the case, what I've got is not a true split spring whittler. I'll post it anyway at the weekend as it's interesting.

David

That will work David, I look forward to it!
B-R

grangerknives
17-09-08, 05:09 PM
Speaking of Split Springs

Here is an old Heritage by Schrade. It's a nice split spring whittler.
(Well I thought it was... )
Actually, it's got a liner between it's 2 springs.

I checked all my whittlers and all the others are 2 spring with no liner
between the springs; 2 springs for the main blade and 1 ea for the smaller blades.
But this one does have swedges on all three spines.

It is hard to see the swedges in these photos on the smaller 2 blades.
One can certainly learn a lot here. Thank you Mick for sharing!!!

Paul

http://i342.photobucket.com/albums/o402/palehorsefighters/heritage1.jpg

http://i342.photobucket.com/albums/o402/palehorsefighters/heritage2.jpg

http://i342.photobucket.com/albums/o402/palehorsefighters/heritage3.jpg

RodgersLad
17-09-08, 05:24 PM
Paul,
my whittlers all look like your one above (i think). Quite a few are Victorian.
Thats interesting to see some were made on one spring. Very clever.

Andy

wellington03
17-09-08, 06:41 PM
Most modern Whittlers have two back springs separated part of the way down the length with a spacer, the two small blades on one end ride on their own spring. The master blade on the other end is very thick and bears on both springs(Many times these are called split spring whittlers, but this is a misnomer). A true split spring whittler has one spring that is actually split on one end. These seem to be a very old design and you can see a good picture of one in Mick's post above. BTW I have also seen Jack knives with split springs.
B-R

A great explanation B-R, the only two s spring two blade jacks I have seen have had awful strong open and close snap, maybe thats why the idea/method never took off in a big way ? I think the dynamics ( :S big word for me) of two separate springs maybe better ??.


That being the case, what I've got is not a true split spring whittler. I'll post it anyway at the weekend as it's interesting.

David

Look forward to seeing your knife/knives David.




http://i342.photobucket.com/albums/o402/palehorsefighters/heritage1.jpg



Hi Paul

Thats an unusual looking whittler (using a cenrtral divider) not often do you see two clip blades on a knife. Did Schrade make a similar knife with a sabre clip master blade ?

thanks for showing


Paul,
my whittlers all look like your one above (i think). Quite a few are Victorian.
Thats interesting to see some were made on one spring. Very clever.

Andy

Hi Andy, I once saw a small J Rodgers two blade Jack, two pen blades with a split spring. It sold for pennies, and I was looking over the buyers shoulder:mad45:

Mick

RodgersLad
17-09-08, 07:26 PM
Army and navy sportmans knives. Made in nickel silver scales and solid silver scales and optional leather case. Both of which are here.

Lock back main blade.

The item with the swivel tool is a cartridge extractor and the two screws inside the scale are for mending something to do with carriages or something to do with horses, i always forget.

Its not very visible in the top picture but the end has a flat screwdriver. Theres a lot going on with these. The silver version of this knife was one of the most expensive knives you could buy from rodgers (that wasnt exhibition obviously).

http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/5462/sarah509uw6.jpg

http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/1961/sarah511yr5.jpg

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/1756/sarah508qo7.jpg

wellington03
17-09-08, 08:29 PM
Two great knives Andy.

As you know these fine 5" closed Joseph Rodgers and Sons all metal eight piece sportsman's knives were sold as "campaigning" knives.

The knives have a locking spear point master and pen blade, gaiter hook, hollow gouge, corkscrew, stone hook, cartridge extractor( 12 & 16 gauge),trace bolts and a screwdriver on the extended central liner.

The top example looks in very good condition, the two bolts are trace bolts for mending damaged harnesses. I like how the master blade locks via a cap lock. The silver knife is a pretty rare item.

In 1906 the Silver knife cost 40/0 (shillings ?) a LOT of money in those days,the metal knife cost 19/0 and the case 2/3

Thanks for showing

Mick :)

dkonopinski
17-09-08, 11:22 PM
I must be making progress. I knew about the harness repair bolts.:)

Amazing knives Andy. Thanks for showing. The knves themselves must be quite rare, but with all the bits & pieces intact makes them extra special.

David

RodgersLad
18-09-08, 04:25 PM
Thanks for the info guys. Very interesting.

Edwardian baby cigar knife. I really love this knife, its so small and well made.

http://img73.imageshack.us/img73/2357/sarah521vm4.jpg

RodgersLad
18-09-08, 04:37 PM
This one is a james rodgers rather than joseph.

Quite interesting to have a clip point blade on such a small knife

http://img54.imageshack.us/img54/482/sarah524sr7.jpg

RodgersLad
18-09-08, 04:40 PM
I like this because of the ruler going along the front.

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/8696/sarah522gn9.jpg

wellington03
18-09-08, 05:33 PM
A marvelous trio of knives Andy

Top, great little oval/cigar knife, the blades look in fabulous condition !

Middle, another beautiful item, the James Rodgers, these leg knives have been made since Roman times, again in vg condition. Made 1830-50 ?

Bottom, lovely N/S sportsman's, spear point master blade locking ?? pen blade, gaiter hook, tin opener, leather gouge, screw driver and corkscrew. Measures on scales 4 1/2" closed ??. Looks Edwardian ?

Thanks for showing all these interesting items :happy15:

Mick

RodgersLad
18-09-08, 08:47 PM
Thanks for that Mick.

Yes i really like the little leg knife. Didnt know they dated back to then!

I think it is edwardian yes, the earlier sportsman i showed was victorian by the way so pretty good going for something probably 120 years old?

This knife has a ruler on each side, infact, i'll upload the other pic. The main blade is a locking knife yes.

http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/9129/sarah523fl6.jpg

wellington03
18-09-08, 09:09 PM
http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/5462/sarah509uw6.jpg





http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/9129/sarah523fl6.jpg

Thanks for all the pics and info Andy

Do you think some of the parts on the two knives above are interchangeable, between the two patterns eg leather gouge, pen blade, corkscrew, gaiter hook , tin opener etc they look pretty similar in size ?.

I have seen a few of these "Campaign" 8 pc sportsman's marked by different firms, but looking identical, inc one made by Wilkinson Sheffield & London (marked "finest sword steel") maybe made by JR & S ??.

Mick :)

RodgersLad
20-09-08, 01:45 PM
Lovely little MOP lobster, Victorian.

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/4997/sarah538ni8.jpg

RodgersLad
20-09-08, 01:48 PM
Medium pruner. My favourite one.

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/3329/sarah533sr0.jpg

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/2678/sarah535qt1.jpg

RodgersLad
20-09-08, 01:53 PM
Victorian whittler pattern.

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/1779/sarah539jb4.jpg

wellington03
20-09-08, 11:48 PM
Three more excellent JR & S examples Andy

Top, a smart little lobster, wonder how easy it is to use a corkscrew (perfume) positioned at one end of a small knife ? must be difficult !

Mid, a superb pruning knife iron liners, rattail bolsters, tapered backspring, glazed blade, stag scales, very nice !

Bottom, a lovely pearl whittler, obvious J Rodgers quality.

Thanks for showing !


Here's a little ivory scaled Ibberson ,made in 1935 (Firth Stainless) two blade pen knife, made for T. B .ROWE & Co Ltd (Rowe's Soaplets). Anyone know anything about the firm ?

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/e7cc73d0.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/68789087.jpg



Mick :)

Blade Runner
21-09-08, 12:12 AM
Good show all:)
B-R

dkonopinski
21-09-08, 09:38 AM
The only thing I can add about T B Rowe is that London E16 is what we now call The Docklands. In 1935, I would guess that a soap maker's premises would not have been a very pleasant place to work and the whole area would have been pretty squalid. They obviously had a shrewd Marketing person who invested in high quality promotional gifts. These will presumably have gone to the buyers in their big retailer customers to keep 'em sweet.

Lovely little knife.

David

wellington03
21-09-08, 08:47 PM
Thanks for the comments and fascinating info on the little Ibberson David !

Here is a link to a site that explains a little more about T.B.ROWE the soap maker :yuck:
http://uk.wrs.yahoo.com/_ylt=A1f4cfxdn9ZI7lsAq71LBQx.;_ylu=X3oDMTE0aG1yMWx pBHNlYwNzcgRwb3MDMQRjb2xvA2lyZAR2dGlkA1VLQzAwNF8xM w--/SIG=11oin27uv/EXP=1222111453/**http%3A//www.brentford.inuk.com/sw.htm


Mick :)

dkonopinski
21-09-08, 08:57 PM
Thanks for the comments and fascinating info on the little Ibberson David !

Here is a link to a site that explains a little more about T.B.ROWE the soap maker :yuck:
http://uk.wrs.yahoo.com/_ylt=A1f4cfxdn9ZI7lsAq71LBQx.;_ylu=X3oDMTE0aG1yMWx pBHNlYwNzcgRwb3MDMQRjb2xvA2lyZAR2dGlkA1VLQzAwNF8xM w--/SIG=11oin27uv/EXP=1222111453/**http%3A//www.brentford.inuk.com/sw.htm


Mick :)

Well discovered, Mick.

wellington03
25-09-08, 12:57 PM
Just like to show this astonishing knife, unused and unsharpened. William IV period or thereabouts.

William Nicholson Folding dirk,circa 1840.

Measuring 5 1/8" closed, 91/2" fully open.

This dirk has a stunning beautifully etched and inlaid with gold dots 4 1/2" blade, (sharpened on one side only with a median ridge down the center).

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/0acfb6ce.jpg

Another pic of the blade, showing the etching.

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/1f3a1354.jpg

The dirk has iron liners, pins and rattail bolsters
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/d3e5f9b5.jpghttp://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/bab9a2a0.jpg

more pics
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/39a5a262.jpghttp://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/c9f794c0.jpg

Thanks for looking

Mick :)

rvr
25-09-08, 01:47 PM
Very elegant!

dkonopinski
25-09-08, 07:02 PM
Mick, that dirk is a lovely piece. What do you know about William Nicholson? It's a new name to me.

Thanks for posting such an elegant knife.

David

wellington03
25-09-08, 08:29 PM
What do you know about William Nicholson?

Thanks for the comments rvr and David :)

All I know about William Nicholson is that the firm manufactured knives in Sheffield between the years 1836-64.

Mick

grace horne
25-09-08, 08:44 PM
That is a TRULY amazing piece for a collection!:O

zorro
25-09-08, 09:18 PM
That is a TRULY amazing piece for a collection!:O

It most certainly is, I would be sweating blood at the thought of engraving that, nerves of steel and a VERY steady hand! :O

dkonopinski
25-09-08, 09:23 PM
Here's some directory entries. One or more may be your dirk man, Willie Nick.

Nicholson, William (, table knife cutler).
Residing at , in 1791.
Recorded in: Universal British Directory - 1791.

Nicholson, William (, pen knife manufacturer and cutlery dealer).
Residing at 4 Sycamore Street, in 1833.
Recorded in: Whites History & Directory of Sheffield - 1833.

Nicholson, William (, spring knife manf.).
Residing at 93 Fitzwilliam street, in 1841.
Recorded in: Henry & Thos. Rodgers Sheff & Roth Directory - 1841.

Nicholson, William (, pen and pocket knife manufacturer).
Residing at 17 Sycamore Street, Sheffield in 1846.
Recorded in: Slaters 1846 Directory, Sheffield.

Nicholson, William (, razor manufacturer).
Residing at 17 Sycamore Street, Sheffield in 1846.
Recorded in: Slaters 1846 Directory, Sheffield.

One Wm.Nicholson was Master Cutler in 1804.

David

RodgersLad
25-09-08, 11:58 PM
What a stunningly beautiful knife Mick, the etching is fantastic!

Thanks for showing that!

Nothing else i can add really, i love the scales, are the buffalo?

Blade Runner
26-09-08, 05:08 AM
Beautiful Dirk Mick, if only she could talk.
B-R

wellington03
26-09-08, 09:24 AM
Nicholson, William (, pen knife manufacturer and cutlery dealer).
Residing at 4 Sycamore Street, in 1833.
Recorded in: Whites History & Directory of Sheffield - 1833.

Nicholson, William (, spring knife manf.).
Residing at 93 Fitzwilliam street, in 1841.
Recorded in: Henry & Thos. Rodgers Sheff & Roth Directory - 1841.

Nicholson, William (, pen and pocket knife manufacturer).
Residing at 17 Sycamore Street, Sheffield in 1846.
Recorded in: Slaters 1846 Directory, Sheffield.

Nicholson, William (, razor manufacturer).
Residing at 17 Sycamore Street, Sheffield in 1846.
Recorded in: Slaters 1846 Directory, Sheffield

Thanks for all the great info David, if I come across anything else concerning this maker I will add to the post at a later date.


Nothing else i can add really, i love the scales, are the buffalo?

Thanks for the comments Andy, Yes the scales are buffalo horn.

Thanks also Grace, Dave and B-R for the positive responses.

Mick

Smiling-Knife
27-09-08, 04:53 PM
The dirk is fantastic Mick. Thanks for sharing it with us. Thanks for the information on Nicholson cutlers David. Anyone have an idea re the leading candidate?

zorro
28-09-08, 06:09 PM
Found this in a box of rubbish yesterday at a car boot sale, I could make out Wragg, Sheffield, nice stag scales, when I got it home and looked properly it's a W H Wragg.

http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll292/zorrothegreyblade/100_1885.jpg
http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll292/zorrothegreyblade/100_1886.jpg
http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll292/zorrothegreyblade/100_1887.jpg

I was aware of John Wragg & Son, and also Eric Wragg, but W. H. was new to me. Turns out he was Erics dad, which makes a nice knife that much sweeter. :)

dkonopinski
28-09-08, 06:26 PM
What a great find. I bet that made your weekend.

David

wellington03
28-09-08, 08:12 PM
The dirk is fantastic Mick. Thanks for sharing it with us. Thanks for the information on Nicholson cutlers David. Anyone have an idea re the leading candidate?

Hi Steve pleased you like the old dirk, I think David on the right lines with William Nicholson, if I can find anything more on the man or his firm I will post it on this thread at a later date.


Found this in a box of rubbish yesterday at a car boot sale, I could make out Wragg, Sheffield, nice stag scales, when I got it home and looked properly it's a W H Wragg.

http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll292/zorrothegreyblade/100_1887.jpg

I was aware of John Wragg & Son, and also Eric Wragg, but W. H. was new to me. Turns out he was Erics dad, which makes a nice knife that much sweeter. :)

Thats a very nice find Dave, I do like those Stag scales. A first glance the knife appears a little unusual in its got a pen blade and two spearpoint blades ?.

Thanks for showing

Here is another pickup ( another Ibberson :sad55: ) A 2121 pat 5 pc marked FO-51

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/9ff21bcd.jpg

Mick

Blade Runner
28-09-08, 08:16 PM
Very nice find zorro! In the next 3 photos I will post an old ivory handled knife marked "G Crookes & Co. Sheffield". According to Goins this marking was used from c.1836-1856. As you can see this old whittler has seen better days, but it is a historic old piece and features the very rare "true split spring.
B-R
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f168/moore6490/100_8633.jpg

Blade Runner
28-09-08, 08:18 PM
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f168/moore6490/100_8648.jpg

Blade Runner
28-09-08, 08:19 PM
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f168/moore6490/100_8663.jpg

wellington03
28-09-08, 08:32 PM
Thats a very interesting Wharncliffe whittler B-R, the backspring differs a little to the few single springs that I have seen, in that the backspring looks like its been forged together from two parts ?. Any chance of a pic of the inside of the spring ?

Thanks for showing

Mick

zorro
28-09-08, 09:02 PM
Thanks David, Mick, B-R. I fell in love with the Wragg before I'd opened the blades, it's one of those pieces that sings to you when you look at it, if you know what I mean. :)

B-R's whittler reminded me of a nice find last week, Eye witness, bone scales, brass liners.

http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll292/zorrothegreyblade/100_1894.jpg

This one is all curves, not a straight edge to be seen, apart from the edge on the main blade. :D

Blade Runner
29-09-08, 12:35 AM
Thats a very interesting Wharncliffe whittler B-R, the backspring differs a little to the few single springs that I have seen, in that the backspring looks like its been forged together from two parts ?. Any chance of a pic of the inside of the spring ?

Thanks for showing

Mick

Another nice catch zorro, yours as well Mick!

You could be right Mick, but in looking at the end of the backspring as well as the inside of the spring she looks solid from here.
B-R
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f168/moore6490/100_8762.jpg

wellington03
29-09-08, 03:44 PM
Thanks for the internal pic of the G Crookes B-R. To be honest without actually being able to see and handle the knife, its very hard to make a further comment.

The split spring whittlers that I have seen have had a single spring split to the balance rivet and no further, all have had a slim tapered brass central divider wedged into the split, keeping the pen blades apart ( could yours be missing this piece ?).

I think the old cutlers who produced these split springs may have split the one half while it was hot and then hammered the split closed when cooled ?.



Mick :)

Blade Runner
29-09-08, 05:39 PM
Thanks for your comments and observations Mick. Not sure if maybe it had a brass wedge at one time, but I will say for a knife that may be close to 170 years old the blade action is great on all 3 blades.

Best,
B-R:)

Smiling-Knife
29-09-08, 06:10 PM
Great additons to your collection Zorro. You have much better boot sales than we do here. Very interesting knife Blade Runner. I really like the looks of the aged ivory scales. Sorry I can't add anything that wasn't already said about the spring. Still a nice bit of history.

Blade Runner
29-09-08, 06:55 PM
Thanks Steve!:)

RodgersLad
06-10-08, 05:42 PM
Great additons to your collection Zorro. You have much better boot sales than we do here. Very interesting knife Blade Runner. I really like the looks of the aged ivory scales. Sorry I can't add anything that wasn't already said about the spring. Still a nice bit of history.

Hi Steve,

not seen you for a while, did you have a good time away?

Ive just got back from holiday today.

Some excellent knives posted everyone!

Andy :)

Smiling-Knife
06-10-08, 05:45 PM
Hi Andy, yes thanks. I had a great holiday in the Bordeaux region of France. I am a wine nut and it was wonderful. How about you. What did you do? Glad to have you back.

RodgersLad
06-10-08, 05:56 PM
Oh that sounds great. I'm afraid i'm more the beer drinker than wine right now but i'm starting to discover some wines that i like now.

My sister lives in new jersey so have just been across there for a few days to visit her. The temperatures have taken a tumble since i was last here.


Little question for everyone, does anyone know much about the maker John Blyde? I noticed that he has produced some exhibition knives in the past. Is it a good maker?

Smiling-Knife
06-10-08, 06:04 PM
HI Andy, you holiday sounds great.

Not much I can add from personal experience on John Blyde, but here is a link that made me drool. They look pretty sweet to me.

http://www.levineknives.com/m.pl/maker.htm?45

dkonopinski
06-10-08, 07:45 PM
Hi Steve & Andy

My goodness don't those John Blyde knives look fantastic?

David

wellington03
07-10-08, 09:29 AM
Little question for everyone, does anyone know much about the maker John Blyde? I noticed that he has produced some exhibition knives in the past. Is it a good maker?

Hi Andy, great to see you back.

All I know, is that John Blyde established the firm in 1841, within a short period of time, the firm relocated to the Clintock Works in Milton street, later sharing the premisis with, then absorbing the business of J Greenhough ?

Greenhough made knives of superb quality, regularly winning Exposition prize medals.


Not much I can add from personal experience on John Blyde, but here is a link that made me drool. They look pretty sweet to me.

http://www.levineknives.com/m.pl/maker.htm?45

A great link Steve, showing a pretty unique stunning collection. The 37 Greenhough knives, plus the rare Sydney 1879 Expo certificate and medal, bank books and John Blyde "GOLFER" trade sign. (most of the knives have the " GOLFER" mark on at least one blade), All are featured in an interesting fifteen page article in the book "Sheffield Exhibition Knives" (Claussen Watts and McMickle).

Of the 37 knives, maybe 10-12 are true exhibition quality ??.

Mick :)

Smiling-Knife
07-10-08, 08:46 PM
Did some digging and found this little knife. The blade tang is marked John Blyde, but no golfer or any other marks. Only 2 1/4 inches closed not including the shackle.

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q265/smiling-knife/Horsemans025.jpg

dkonopinski
07-10-08, 09:39 PM
Steve, might that John Blyde be a ladies knife being small and with a button hook?

David

wellington03
07-10-08, 09:44 PM
Hi David, you are right in thinking Steves great little knife, (having a blade and button hook) is a ladies knife.

Its the first Blyde/Greenhough knife I have seen for ages !

Thanks for showing

Mick :)

RodgersLad
08-10-08, 07:20 PM
Thanks for all the info on the john blydes everyone!

The new knife i have is a 3 bladed MOP whittler. Shall hopefully be posting pics soon.

Andy

Me&Fe
09-10-08, 08:00 PM
Hi all.Just wanted to know if anyone has any info on the sheffield knifemaker 'S Hibbert & Sons.I will post a pic of it soon..its a bit unusual!

Me&Fe
09-10-08, 08:28 PM
Here it is.what trades do you think used it?http://i483.photobucket.com/albums/rr197/MeAndFe/PICT1874.jpg

Smiling-Knife
09-10-08, 08:50 PM
Cool knife. Samuel Hibbert & Sons. Sorry don't know much about the maker. The unusual blade is a raze or timber scriber. It was used to mark wood barrels, crates and the like. It was used by dock workers, shippers, warehouse workers etc. Hopefully, someone else will have more info. Very nice stag handles.

RodgersLad
09-10-08, 09:26 PM
Arent these a very common pattern in american knife manufacturers especially?

Lovely scales. I have heard of that maker yes.

RodgersLad
09-10-08, 09:44 PM
Some of you may remember a while ago that i posted an OSS knife that was in reasonable condition. Well luckily, i managed to find this stunning condition one instead.

Its a truly great pattern. Never used and in its original case, ive never seen an original case before. I'm very proud to own this knife : )

http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/7196/sarah569vh7.jpg

LH 600
09-10-08, 10:35 PM
Some of you may remember a while ago that i posted an OSS knife that was in reasonable condition. Well luckily, i managed to find this stunning condition one instead.

Its a truly great pattern. Never used and in its original case, ive never seen an original case before. I'm very proud to own this knife : )

http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/7196/sarah569vh7.jpg


That knife are very rare .
Nice :)

wellington03
09-10-08, 10:46 PM
The old OSS knife



http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/5741/img0626kh8.jpg




Some of you may remember a while ago that i posted an OSS knife that was in reasonable condition. Well luckily, i managed to find this stunning condition one instead.

Its a truly great pattern. Never used and in its original case, ive never seen an original case

http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/7196/sarah569vh7.jpg

Your new OSS knife is in amazing condition Andy, and it has its original case. A very rare knife !

Thanks for showing :happy15:

Mick

RodgersLad
10-10-08, 12:36 PM
Thanks for the comments on the OSS guys.

And thanks for bringing forward the picture of the older one Mick, i can't believe the difference now they are side by side.

Andy

dkonopinski
10-10-08, 01:06 PM
Some of you may remember a while ago that i posted an OSS knife that was in reasonable condition. Well luckily, i managed to find this stunning condition one instead.

Its a truly great pattern. Never used and in its original case, ive never seen an original case before. I'm very proud to own this knife : )

http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/7196/sarah569vh7.jpg

Wonderful knife that, Andy. I can't make out what it says on the handle. Is it any clearer to the eye, mate?

RodgersLad
10-10-08, 02:22 PM
Oh yes, sorry about that, its plain to see to the eye, its because of the glare of the nickel handle on my camera.

Its the same RD number that was posted earlier in this thread. All the knives came with the stamp.

I cant understand why this knife was discontinued because of unpopularity. It looks really useful to me. Having said that, its a mighty heavy knife. You'd have to hold it to appreciate its weight. I guess three tools on such a heavy knife could be seen as unnecessary weight to carry.

I know i wouldn't fancy carrying it on my belt.

Andy

Smiling-Knife
10-10-08, 02:33 PM
Wow Andy!! That is fantastic. If you don't mind me asking... where did you find such a treasure? I'd like to see pics of the case as well if possible please. Great catch.

RodgersLad
10-10-08, 02:38 PM
Thanks Steve,

To be honest, i didnt know if people would be interested in this much as i posted the pattern earlier but i will do new pics of the marks on the other side and the case.

Andy

RodgersLad
11-10-08, 03:08 PM
I really do like this one.

A really good pattern. All very useful tools.

http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/8084/sarah574lr7.jpg

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/303/sarah575cn6.jpg

dkonopinski
11-10-08, 03:12 PM
That's a beauty. Any idea regarding the date?

David

Smiling-Knife
11-10-08, 03:12 PM
How sweet it is!. What is the short flat attachment for? You have a fantastic collection Andy. Thanks very much for sharing it with us.

RodgersLad
11-10-08, 03:19 PM
Its not too early, i would say around 1915-1930 which i know is quite a broad date but its hard to be more specific.

I think the short tool is a screwdriver but i used to think these were like a chisel because the end is very sharp like a blade.

Thanks for the comments guys, glad you like it like i do.

Andy

wellington03
11-10-08, 03:27 PM
A great looking sports/utility ? knife Andy !, obvious quality, glazed blades/tools. Unused, well marked, mint condition. Very nice !

Thanks for showing

Mick

RodgersLad
11-10-08, 03:38 PM
Thanks very much for the comments Mick.

Here is a picture of the case for the OSS and the markings to the front. I guess the case was the reason this one survived so well.

http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/2825/sarah583ni4.jpg

http://img380.imageshack.us/img380/4993/sarah568if8.jpg

RodgersLad
11-10-08, 04:30 PM
I was bidding on this knife somewhere the other day and thought it was quite interesting. Its made by george butler and co and has a small magnifying glass towards the end. Quite clever isn't it, don't think ive seen one before.

http://i8.ebayimg.com/03/i/001/0e/b8/8d52_1.JPG

wellington03
11-10-08, 08:39 PM
Thanks for the pics Andy.

The OSS leather sheath/holder looks in very good condition, like the knife.

The little G Butler & Co knife, is an interesting item, note the 2 pc t/shell scales containing the magnifying glass and its overall profile and two slender blades. Mid-late Victorian ?, could the knife have been made as a naturalists model, for insect and butterfly specimen collecting ?

A great find, thanks for showing

Mick :)

bushmansedge
12-10-08, 03:01 PM
Could that be a pipe bowl scraper ?

RodgersLad
12-10-08, 03:38 PM
Thanks for the info on the knife Mick, its really interesting.

RodgersLad
12-10-08, 03:41 PM
Don't think i have posted this one before.

http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/236/sarah576ut7.jpg

zorro
12-10-08, 03:47 PM
Some beauties there RodgersLad, thanks for sharing.:biggthump

RodgersLad
12-10-08, 03:55 PM
Thanks zorro, this ones a wostenholm but one of my favourites, better than almost all of my JR's (in my opinion), it has something special about it.

http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/470/sarah551rz0.jpg

wellington03
12-10-08, 04:09 PM
Two more superb examples Andy !

The little JR & Sons knife, whats its closed length ?

The Wosty four blade senator is a cracking item, my guess is that it was made between 1925-30

I will post pics of a couple of Wostenholms made at about the same time later

Thanks for showing

Mick

dkonopinski
12-10-08, 04:29 PM
I do like the bolsters on the JR, Andy. On the Wosty it looks as if there are cut outs on the scales and outer liners for the nail nicks, but they've left the inner liner (the one between the two springs) with a straight profile. Have I got that right or is it a trick of the pic?

David

PS Once again thanks for sharing your collection, Andy

wellington03
12-10-08, 04:35 PM
I*XL GEORGE WOSTENHOLM SHEFFIELD ENGLAND 3 1/4" 6 pc lobster pocket knife Circa 1926. This knife has a spear point master blade, a corn blade ( full, as made )pen blade, button hook, picker and long nail file. It comes with its original leather pouch. The blades have a glazed finish. Unused condition.

In the past I have had two more knives identicle to this one, very high quality ( for the period ), the other two knives were both marked with Fred Osbornes mark and the year made 1926.

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03270.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03273.jpg

I*XL GEORGE WOSTENHOLM SHEFFIELD ENGLAND 3 1/4" Equal end whittler Circa 1930. Spear point master and pen blade and a manicure blade. This knife is similar to one shown earlier in this thread, but this knife is a little shorter and is in pristine condition, again glazed blades.

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03263.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03264.jpg

Mick :)

Smiling-Knife
12-10-08, 04:42 PM
As always.... spectacular knives Mick. It's like having a museum at our finger tips. Thanks very much for sharing.

RodgersLad
12-10-08, 04:44 PM
David, you are right yes, the MOP has been cut out of the scale but the brass liners still stand in the back. The liners are milled aswell.

Mick, i will give a length for the JR when i get it out again, i always forget to do the measurements.

The two wostys you posted are very very good. Especially the lobster. Thanks for showing those.

Andy

Smiling-Knife
12-10-08, 04:49 PM
Excellent four blade knives Andy. The second one on this page is especially knice. Thanks. Mick's mention of the corn blade got me to think about this knife. Do you think the small blade on the right of this Frank Mills knife is a corn blade? Thanks.

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q265/smiling-knife/26-05007-1.jpg

RodgersLad
12-10-08, 05:37 PM
The corn knives i have seen by rodgers and wostenholm were not shaped like this, the blade edge comes inwards and then outwards again towards the end. Apparently, corn knife blades are made of a very fine soft steel aswell as i know they shouldn't be used on anything harder than skin.

This is as far as i know, i could be completely wrong.

I personally would say it was a spey shape blade. You see this example of a corn knife below.

http://www.agrussell.com/images/art/gbs.cornblade.jpg

wellington03
12-10-08, 05:46 PM
Excellent four blade knives Andy. The second one on this page is especially knice. Thanks. Mick's mention of the corn blade got me to think about this knife. Do you think the small blade on the right of this Frank Mills knife is a corn blade? Thanks.




The corn knives i have seen by rodgers and wostenholm were not shaped like this, the blade edge comes inwards and then outwards again towards the end. Apparently, corn knife blades are made of a very fine soft steel aswell as i know they shouldn't be used on anything harder than skin.

This is as far as i know, i could be completely wrong.

I personally would say it was a spey shape blade. You see this example of a corn knife


Hi guys, I realised my error soon after posting :rolleyes:

Andy is correct, the small blades on both my I*XL and Steves Frank Mills senator are indeed a spey blades.

Cheers Mick

RodgersLad
12-10-08, 05:53 PM
Thanks Mick.

Wow, i am actually learning blade shapes without looking them up now :D

Smiling-Knife
12-10-08, 05:58 PM
Thanks for the replies guys. It is very similar to a spey blade on a stockman or trapper. Why do you think there is a spey blade on a gentlemen's folder or lobster? Just wondering.

RodgersLad
12-10-08, 06:01 PM
I read somewhere that spey shaped blades are useful for doing cutting strokes rather than backwards and forwards motions.

But pen blades were still being made years after quills were stopped being used so i guess anything goes.

dkonopinski
12-10-08, 08:03 PM
"Brains" here has been wondering why anyone would want to cut corn with a folding knife rather than a scythe. Andy's "shouldn't be used on anything harder than skin" comment has turned the light on.:rolleyes:

They don't call me "Lightning" for nothing, y'know.

David

RodgersLad
12-10-08, 08:14 PM
haha David, that really made me laugh. How long would it take to work an entire field with a pocket knife :D Don't worry about it, there's so much info out there, you probably could teach me things i dont know for a week. I just know about corn knives because i have a few.

They quite often get chipped blades because people use them on too hard surfaces.

wellington03
12-10-08, 08:32 PM
"Brains" here has been wondering why anyone would want to cut corn with a folding knife rather than a scythe. Andy's "shouldn't be used on anything harder than skin" comment has turned the light on.:rolleyes:

They don't call me "Lightning" for nothing, y'know.

David

:lol: :lol: Thats cheered me up no end David !


Here is something a little more basic

BROOKES AND CROOKES SHEFFIELD ENGLAND Knife, fork and spoon combination, with a corkscrew Circa 1900. Measuring 4 1/4".

Here is a superb combination knife, made by one of the top Sheffield firms, Brookes and Crookes. Everything about this knife is tight and sharp. Great stag scales brass liners and square tangs.

Maybe it was made just pre Boer War ?

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03260.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03256.jpg

A few more pics

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03257.jpg


http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03255.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03258.jpg

Thanks for looking

Mick

dkonopinski
12-10-08, 10:30 PM
Glad to raise a smile.

I must admit I've come across the term Corn Knife before and just assumed it was something to do with making traditional corn dollies or some such. It has never occurred to me that it was a surgical blade.:lol:

Mick, that hobo knife is lovely. What are the marks on the back of the spoon stem? I wouldn't have expected a hallmark. Is it silver? Surely not. E P N S maybe?

David

TOM STRATTON
13-10-08, 12:20 AM
I may be off the mark here,but in Kentucky when I was a kid they had a corn knife that was used for cutting corn and shocking it in the fields.It varied in length around 12-24 inches and many were or at least had that homemade look.

RodgersLad
13-10-08, 12:43 AM
Very nice hobo Mick yes.

The fork and spoon will both be plated silver right?

I actually have a similar rodgers one of these but in ivory (with a knife/corkscrew) but they don't attach together. Each item folds seperately.

I need to look into myn actually because one thing that always puzzled me is the blade on the knife is JR but the plate is marked with a different sheffield maker and the fork and spoon look exactly the same style as yours Mick, can you give the makers marks so i can see if they are the same?

Andy

herbicide
13-10-08, 09:15 AM
I picked this (and the Zippo) up in Elsecar on Saturday, from that huge antiques place in the Heritage Centre, if anyone knows it.

85mm long, Silver plated brass bolsters, spear-point master, pen and coping blades.
Needs a bit of TLC and at least one new pin.
http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/3439/rhk1dr2.jpg
I don't think they're actually bone scales, now I have hold of it.
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/7692/rhk4xd5.jpg
http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/3677/rhk2ax7.jpg
Real HOMELAND Knife (nothing on Google(!))
http://img392.imageshack.us/img392/8135/rhk3ed7.jpg
WALKER & [...] (Google says it'll be Walker and Hall)
SHEFFIELD

wellington03
13-10-08, 09:52 AM
I may be off the mark here,but in Kentucky when I was a kid they had a corn knife that was used for cutting corn and shocking it in the fields.It varied in length around 12-24 inches and many were or at least had that homemade look.
Hi Tom, over here, we used to use a sickle ( I still have mine :rolleyes: under the bed !), the slicing drawing action perfect for cutting corn. The knives they used in Kentucky , had they a straight blade with a curved end ?, like the simple trade knives, with a beech wood handle ?


The fork and spoon will both be plated silver right?

I actually have a similar rodgers one of these but in ivory (with a knife/corkscrew) but they don't attach together. Each item folds seperately.

I need to look into myn actually because one thing that always puzzled me is the blade on the knife is JR but the plate is marked with a different sheffield maker and the fork and spoon look exactly the same style as yours Mick, can you give the makers marks so i can see if they are the same?

Andy

Hi Andy, the fork and spoon on my combination set are plated, both items are marked B & C ( Brookes and Crookes ).

I used to have a J Nowill & Sons combination knife, made for A & N stores London, very similar to your JR. The plated fork and spoon were made by William Hutton & Sons (crossed arrows). I think Huttons made a lot of the plated items used by the Sheffield cutlers.


I picked this (and the Zippo) up in Elsecar on Saturday, from that huge antiques place in the Heritage Centre, if anyone knows it.

85mm long, Silver plated brass bolsters, spear-point master, pen and wharncliffe blades.


Thats a tidy and very nice looking W & H equal end whittler. It has spearpoint, pen and coping ( not wharncliffe) blades, all look full . The scales look like ivory. N/S bolsters . This knife has no central divider between the back springs, but uses a small spacer/divider at the end of the knife to keep the small blades apart.

Made for export to the US ?

Thanks for showing

Mick

herbicide
13-10-08, 10:18 AM
Thats a tidy and very nice looking W & H equal end whittler
[...]

Made for export to the US ?


No idea.... I was hoping someone here would know more about it.

Yorkshireman
13-10-08, 12:57 PM
I may be off the mark here,but in Kentucky when I was a kid they had a corn knife that was used for cutting corn and shocking it in the fields.It varied in length around 12-24 inches and many were or at least had that homemade look.

I think there may be some misunderstanding here. To an Englishman, "corn" means wheat, not maize.

wellington03
13-10-08, 01:59 PM
I may be off the mark here,but in Kentucky when I was a kid they had a corn knife that was used for cutting corn and shocking it in the fields.It varied in length around 12-24 inches and many were or at least had that homemade look.


I think there may be some misunderstanding here. To an Englishman, "corn" means wheat, not maize.


Yep ,I was a little confused earlier :S

Just found this knife, 24" long, and wondered if its the sort of thing Tom was talking about ?

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/0842007009.jpg

Mick

wellington03
13-10-08, 07:21 PM
BROOKES AND CROOKES, SHEFFIELD Wharncliffe Knife, 2 7/8" Circa 1870.

Here is a beautiful knife. Having a wharncliffe master blade and a pen blade, both of which have a long pull running back through the tangs, the blades have a crocus finish. The backspring is fileworked and guilded. The ivory scales are carved. Unused with its original leather pouch.

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03281.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03284.jpg


A few more pics
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03285.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03286.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03283.jpg

Thanks for looking

Mick :)

zorro
13-10-08, 09:43 PM
BROOKES AND CROOKES, SHEFFIELD Wharncliffe Knife, 2 7/8" Circa 1870.

Here is a beautiful knife. Having a wharncliffe master blade and a pen blade, both of which have a long pull running back through the tangs, the blades have a crocus finish. The backspring is fileworked and guilded. The ivory scales are carved. Unused with its original leather pouch.

Mick :)

That's it, I think I'm in love. :)

And the knife's not bad either! :D

mloc
13-10-08, 10:40 PM
Yep ,I was a little confused earlier :S

Just found this knife, 24" long, and wondered if its the sort of thing Tom was talking about ?

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/0842007009.jpg

Mick

OHH:happy22: :happy62::] thats a nice looking Martindale

RodgersLad
14-10-08, 01:01 AM
Mick,

i absolutely love that B&C ivory knife. I really do like that pattern, ive seen it a few times in carved MOP aswell.

The marks on my hobo type knife are like you said i think, hutton and co. Thanks for that. I shall post pics of the set up soon.

Andy : )

dkonopinski
14-10-08, 08:28 AM
Mik, that B & C Wharnie is just a dream knife. So far I've never seen a knife with those long nail pulls apart from those posted on this thread. Was the long pull just a style thing or does it serve some other purpose?

David

Smiling-Knife
14-10-08, 09:06 AM
That is another beauty Mick. So many things to like about that knife. Beyond the obviously gorgeous scales, I like the long nail nick right through the tang and the swedges on the blades. Thanks again for sharing with us.

I had a good laugh over the 'corn' posts earlier guys. The image of taking on a field of crops with pocket knife still makes me chuckle.

wellington03
14-10-08, 09:30 AM
Mick,

i absolutely love that B&C ivory knife. I really do like that pattern, ive seen it a few times in carved MOP aswell.

The marks on my hobo type knife are like you said i think, hutton and co. Thanks for that. I shall post pics of the set up soon.

Andy : )

Hi Andy, pleased you like the little knife, the pattern is known as NAUTILUS named after the submarine of the same name, featured in the famous book, witten by Jules Verne twenty thousand leagues under the sea (first published in 1870)

The nautilus pattern was made by more than one firm, and could be regarded as a "town pattern".

The wharncliffe blade on the B & C is unusual for this pattern, as are the ivory scales, as you know these knives are usually hafted in pearl

(Looking forward to seenig your combination knife Andy)


Mik, that B & C Wharnie is just a dream knife. So far I've never seen a knife with those long nail pulls apart from those posted on this thread. Was the long pull just a style thing or does it serve some other purpose?

David

Delighted you like the knife David.

The extended long pull nail nicks that run back through the tangs, are a sure sign of quality. Only used usually on the very best knives.





Just like to show another knife.

LEVICK LEVIGN ? Quill knife. 3" Circa 1790-1810

This two bladed quill knife, is of extraordinary quality. The scales are made from pearl, t/shell and gold, the bolsters and pins also gold.

I don't know anything about the maker ?

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03278.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03277.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03279.jpg

Thanks for looking

Mick :)

RodgersLad
14-10-08, 10:27 AM
What a beautiful knife Mick, never seen one that mixes MOP and shell like that and that is a lovely piece of shell in the scale too.

What is it called when the pins have that kind of flower petal look?

Is it usually used on older knives? I think ive only had one before.

Andy

dkonopinski
14-10-08, 10:44 AM
The Levick is another stunner. Never seen anything like it.

David

wellington03
14-10-08, 11:20 AM
What a beautiful knife Mick, never seen one that mixes MOP and shell like that and that is a lovely piece of shell in the scale too.

What is it called when the pins have that kind of flower petal look?

Is it usually used on older knives? I think ive only had one before.

Andy

Pleased you like it Andy

The pin covers are known as "Rose Gold Flower Head pin covers"



The Levick is another stunner. Never seen anything like it.

David

Thanks for the responce David, very pleased you like it.


I have had another good look at the tang stamp and believe the mark may read LEVIGN. Could still be Sheffield made, BUT sounds French !!!!!.

Could have been made a little earlier 1790-1810

Mick :mad66:

dkonopinski
14-10-08, 11:28 AM
Mick, could it be Levigne?

Take a look here - 5th knife down. Dates don't coincide, but you never know. Could be a later generation of the same family.

http://www.autoknife.info/French_4.html

David

Hector
14-10-08, 11:31 AM
Very nice; I do not think it is English.

Might be German or Central European ? Czech??

just guessing really, but the tang stamp looks like a factory stamp.


Just my groping in the dark.

:rolleyes:

wellington03
14-10-08, 11:48 AM
Very nice; I do not think it is English.

Might be German or Central European ? Czech??

just guessing really, but the tang stamp looks like a factory stamp.


Just my groping in the dark.

:rolleyes:

Not sure, but I think French or English more likely ?


Mick, could it be Levigne?

Take a look here - 5th knife down. Dates don't coincide, but you never know. Could be a later generation of the same family.

http://www.autoknife.info/French_4.html

David

Hi David, not sure about anything just at the moment, I think LEVIGN is just an old spelling for the more common LEVINE.

Back to LEVICK, there was a John Levick and Son Pond Lane Sheffield,( 1778 ).

Mick:S

dkonopinski
14-10-08, 11:58 AM
Thinking about those scales, there were lots of Levicks involved in the import, merchanting and cutting of horn, ivory and other scale material. Tortoise shell is specifically mentioned.

Here's one example:

Levick, James (, ivory and tortoise shell &c. merchant).
Residing at 35 Pinstone Street, in 1833.
Recorded in: Whites History & Directory of Sheffield - 1833.

David

RodgersLad
14-10-08, 12:37 PM
Hmmm pretty sure its not Eastern european and i dont think it looks French either.

The one mentioned above about pinstone street sounds very good to me. Its obviously quite early, from things i have seen similar, i would say 1820-1835?

You guys probably have noticed i go crazy for the scale materials on the sheffield knives though and thats just a beautiful piece of shell.

Andy

wellington03
14-10-08, 01:09 PM
BROOKES AND CROOKES, SHEFFIELD Wharncliffe Knife, 2 7/8" Circa 1870.
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03284.jpg

Just like to mention a few more things regarding these "nautillus" pattern knives.

They were made by many firms.

They are always made to exactly the same dimentions, usually having carved pearl scales.

They all, inc my own ivory B & C, many common features.

They are exactly the same size, they have extended long pulls running through the tangs ( usually they have twin sheepfoot blades ), they have gilded surpentine filework.

Maybe a little mester specialised in making these knives, for all the different firms, to order ??.

Mick

wellington03
14-10-08, 01:15 PM
Hmmm pretty sure its not Eastern european and i dont think it looks French either.

The one mentioned above about pinstone street sounds very good to me. Its obviously quite early, from things i have seen similar, i would say 1820-1835?

You guys probably have noticed i go crazy for the scale materials on the sheffield knives though and thats just a beautiful piece of shell.

Andy

Hi Andy & David

Thank you both for the comments and suggestions.

I have cleaned the mark gently, inside and out, it looks like LEVICK,

see pic

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/0842007020.jpg

The pen and pocket knife maker John Levick and Son, Pond lane used the mark " LEVIK MERIT". (1778 )

Maybe it was the son or grandsons mark, 30-40 years later ?.

I am now pretty sure the quill knife is Sheffield made.

Mick

wellington03
16-10-08, 12:39 PM
Just like to show this used, but very worthy knife.

STEARS Wharncliffe whittler 4 1/2" Circa 1870.

Here is a very old knife made by an unknown maker, anyone any ideas ??.

The wharncliffe mater blade has had some use and been sharpened. The pen and coping blades have seen very little use, they are on square tangs. Beautiful stag scales, birds-eye pins.



http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/0842007014-1.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03268.jpg

A few more pics

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03266.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03242.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03243.jpg

Thanks for looking.

Mick

dkonopinski
16-10-08, 02:33 PM
This might be a lead

Stears William, Crooks moor Stears and Co. (and nail nippers) 8, Townhead street
Listed a scissor makers in Baines's Directory and Gazetteer Directory of 1822.

David

Yorkshireman
17-10-08, 07:51 AM
Interesting rivets, reminiscent of razor pins. Are they formed in one piece, or do they use a washer ?

wellington03
17-10-08, 11:40 AM
This might be a lead

Stears William, Crooks moor Stears and Co. (and nail nippers) 8, Townhead street
Listed a scissor makers in Baines's Directory and Gazetteer Directory of 1822.

David

Thanks for the info David, that looks a promising lead.



Interesting rivets, reminiscent of razor pins. Are they formed in one piece, or do they use a washer ?

I think the birds-eye pins were formed in one piece. As far as I know no modern maker uses this finish on pins and rivets.


An earlier post on this thread, showing another example.
http://www.britishblades.com/forums/showpost.php?p=910521&postcount=625

Mick

wellington03
17-10-08, 12:49 PM
That is another beauty Mick. So many things to like about that knife. Beyond the obviously gorgeous scales, I like the long nail nick right through the tang and the swedges on the blades. Thanks again for sharing with us.



Thanks for the comments on the earlier knife Steve.

Here is a little knife I had intended to post after the B & C Nautillus, this knife has similar extended long pulls and cut in swages.

I*XL G WOSTENHOLM, SHEFFIELD 2 1/2" Silver senator, Circa 1890.

This knife is of extremely high quality, having a spear point master ( having extended long pulls on either side) two pen blades and a manicure ( Curlys pat), all of which again have the extended pulls. All blades have cut in swages. The scales are cast silver, and the back springs are plated in silver. Square tangs.

As the scales are not hall marked, ( up until the end of April 1890 the monarchs head was stamped on all silver items, except those not liable. This was to show that duty had been paid, many sponsors who were not the actual makers did not have their items marked to avoid paying tax ). it is highly likely Wostenholms sold the carcass ( the blades and springs ) to a third party ( a high end jeweller ?) to make up the knife to their own spec.


http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/0842007014.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/0842007013.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/0842007016-1.jpg

Thanks for looking

Mick

dkonopinski
17-10-08, 01:11 PM
Mick

This looks like the scale design has been deliberately done to incorporate and therby visually almost eliminate the heads of the rivets.

David

wellington03
17-10-08, 01:22 PM
Mick

This looks like the scale design has been deliberately done to incorporate and therby visually almost eliminate the heads of the rivets.

David

Hi David,

The makers of the Wosty cleverly used the design on the scales to camouflage the rivet heads. It's a great little item, even the milled central liner is silver.

Maybe made up in the US ?

Mick

grace horne
17-10-08, 04:23 PM
I think the birds-eye pins were formed in one piece. As far as I know no modern maker uses this finish on pins and rivets.



Now that, my dear, sounds like a challenge...would look good on a lovely little (faux) tortoiseshell, don't you think?:D

RodgersLad
17-10-08, 06:14 PM
Mick,

that IXL knife is so nice and you right, very clever how they have blended the rivet in.

The central liner in my silver wostenholm has a milled central silver liner too.

Andy

wellington03
17-10-08, 08:21 PM
Now that, my dear, sounds like a challenge...would look good on a lovely little (faux) tortoiseshell, don't you think?:D

Looking forward to seeing what you can come up with Grace !



Mick,

that IXL knife is so nice and you right, very clever how they have blended the rivet in.

The central liner in my silver wostenholm has a milled central silver liner too.

Andy

Sounds a very smart knife Andy, I think the majority of these unmarked silver knives were made up in the US. 1890-on

Mick :)

RodgersLad
18-10-08, 01:54 PM
C johnson knife.

Blades marked johnson western works sheffield

The backs of all tools are marked "flag knife", does anyone know if that was a usual mark or is it the name of this knife?


http://img392.imageshack.us/img392/5745/sarah608ge8.jpg

http://img392.imageshack.us/img392/7094/sarah609oj2.jpg

Smiling-Knife
18-10-08, 02:04 PM
That's a little beauty Andy. What is the length please? Nice milled liners always add a touch of class. I think it is Christopher Johnson & Co, Western Works.

RodgersLad
18-10-08, 02:18 PM
Hi Steve,

its closed length is 2". The liners are very nice yes. I didnt think my picture had picked up on them but it has.

Andy

RodgersLad
18-10-08, 02:23 PM
Lovely two blade knife by rodgers. Victorian, nickel silver bolsters, quill and pen blade. Ivory scales.

2.4" closed up.

http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/8652/sarah611vd4.jpg

wellington03
18-10-08, 02:41 PM
Two more superb little knives Andy, both look in outstanding condition.

The C J and Co knife has beautiful t/shell scales, milled liners etc, a ladies knife.

The J R and Sons knife small, light and slim, are the blades fairly light and easy to open ?, an extra thin "ladies" knife ?

Thanks for showing !!

Mick :)

RodgersLad
18-10-08, 04:14 PM
Mick,

glad you like them. Yes the blades are very delicate and easy to open. Forget to mention aswell, it has brass liners.

Don't think i have shown these here yet. Officers campaign sets in buffalo, ivory and shell. I think the edges are pewter but am not definate.

http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/4029/img0635md2.jpg

Me&Fe
18-10-08, 04:45 PM
My new find today.A vintage Chesterman Sheffield rule/knife.The blades are marked 'Joseph Westby Sheffield' and also marked 'Pearson Norwich'(merchant,Dealer??)The rule folds ot to 6 inches and is graduated in 1/2mm,mm,16/ths,1/8ths,32nds,64ths,and 20ths,50ths and 100ths.I guess it was made before the Rabone/Chesterman merge...How old?Rare?http://i483.photobucket.com/albums/rr197/MeAndFe/PICT1891.jpg

wellington03
18-10-08, 07:32 PM
http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/4029/img0635md2.jpg

Hi Andy

The surprises keep coming !

Three matching Joseph Rodgers and Sons campaign sets !, in t/shell, ivory and buffalo.

Great to see the three sets side by side.

Thanks for showing !

:happy15:




How old?Rare?http://i483.photobucket.com/albums/rr197/MeAndFe/PICT1891.jpg

Hi,

The knife/ruler was made well before the J Rabone & Sons/Chesterman, Sheffield 1984 merger. Just a guess late 1930s ?. Made in quantity

Thanks for showing

Mick :)

Me&Fe
18-10-08, 08:57 PM
Thanks for the info on the Rabone/Chesterman merger.Didnt realise it was that late.:)

wellington03
18-10-08, 09:24 PM
W MILLS & SON, SHEFFIELD ENGLAND

Three knives made by Ernest Mills, one ivory equal end pen knife has been shown on this thread before ( top). I have now managed to acquire another identical knife, beautifully ivory scales, gilded file worked back spring, superb walk and talk, made pre WWII. In the same pic there is a 3 1/4" Mills 6 pc made just post war with celluloid scales, top quality, amazing walk and talk ! Also a pair of scissors marked J Nowill & Sons ( cross keys,*D).

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/d4c524df.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/05a83815.jpghttp://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/cb65e4bd.jpg



The Mills 6 pc has a spear point master, clip blade, pen blade, spey blade, nail file and picker.

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/4a6cc9e7.jpghttp://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/6af0b9c1.jpg

Mick :)

dkonopinski
19-10-08, 06:05 PM
I dunno. I go off line for a day & a half and you guys come up with another brace or two of real gems. Thanks for showing.

David

RodgersLad
20-10-08, 09:01 PM
wow mick, those mills are very very nice, especially the two equal ends.

Thanks for showing them.

Andy

wellington03
21-10-08, 12:14 AM
I dunno. I go off line for a day & a half and you guys come up with another brace or two of real gems. Thanks for showing.

David
Thanks for the positive comments David, Andy, in particular deserves a LOT of credit for posting many wonderful items lately. Great to see.


wow mick, those mills are very very nice, especially the two equal ends.
Andy
Pleased you like the Mills knives Andy, the two ivory penkives are mint, identical in every way and quite exquisite. But its the 6pc lobster that really takes my fancy, the only Mills knife I have come across in this pattern, I do actually like :rolleyes: the celluloid scales ( a sign of the times 1950s ?).

Just like to show this unused pruner, with a tapered forged back spring, very similar to one shown earlier in this thread by S-K. This example was made by THOMAS TURNER & CO , SHEFFIELD ENGLAND (ENCORE)( Cutlers to his Majesty ) 3 1/2"

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03293.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/DSC03292.jpg

Mick :)

Smiling-Knife
21-10-08, 06:59 PM
That's a nice looking stag prunning knife Mick. BTW those ivory-scaled Mills knives are pure class.

This is a two blade variation of the prunner made by Thos Turner & Co. I call it a hawkbill jack but maybe someone has a more appropriate name for it.

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q265/smiling-knife/26-05076.jpg
http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q265/smiling-knife/26-05072.jpg

wellington03
21-10-08, 08:54 PM
Pleased you like the little Mills ivorys Steve .

Thats a very nice twin bladed TT pruner, could it be the twin blade version of my own ? they look very similar.

Most older pruners that I have seen have been single-bladed, only a few have had secondary blades, either a pen blade or a pruning saw.

Great item, thanks for showing :happy15:

Mick

dkonopinski
21-10-08, 10:54 PM
maybe someone has a more appropriate name for it.

Gladys.

I'm not into pruners, but I do love the scales on these.

David

RodgersLad
22-10-08, 02:36 PM
Two blade victorian pen/quill made by Bright & Sons of sheffield. Does anyone have any info on this maker please? Ivory scale, silver shield.

2nd knfe is J.Torrill? 250 Regents st, sheffield.

http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/1783/sarah616es4.jpg

http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/5787/sarah619wr6.jpg

http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/460/sarah620nk2.jpg

dkonopinski
22-10-08, 03:05 PM
A very elegant pair of knives there. As for Bright & Sons, could they be the Sheffield Jewellers which still exists and is over 150 years old as a business? They would probably be sponsors rather than the maker, I suppose. If so have a look here:

http://www.chrishobbs.com/horatiobrightfamily.htm

Other possible & perhaps more likely connections are:

Bright, (Widow, cutler).
Residing at Holles Croft, in 1787.
Recorded in: Gales & Martin Directory of Sheffield - 1787.

Bright, George (, Spanish Knife Mnfr).
Residing at Court 26, Pea Croft; h.Daisy Walk, in 1833.
Recorded in: Whites History & Directory of Sheffield - 1833.

Bright, Matthew (, scissor manufacturer).
Residing at 50 Green Lane, Sheffield in 1825.
Recorded in: Gells 1825 Directory of Sheffield.

There could also be a connection here I suppose:

http://www.ssbrightdrawers.com/

David

RodgersLad
22-10-08, 06:08 PM
Thanks for that info.

This is a new wostenholm pruner knife i have. One of my favourite knives.

Measures 8 1/4" fully opened.

http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/1706/sarah612qd5.jpg

http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/2536/sarah614fd3.jpg

wellington03
22-10-08, 06:18 PM
http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/1783/sarah616es4.jpg


http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/460/sarah620nk2.jpg

Two lovely examples Andy,

The first (top) Bright and Sons swell center pen knife, looks in remarkable condition, original polish on the blades, great ivory "pristine" a stunning example.

The J Torrill penknife again very good condition, an unusual pattern, crown or coffin ??.

Thanks for showing !


A very elegant pair of knives there. As for Bright & Sons, could they be the Sheffield Jewellers which still exists and is over 150 years old as a business? They would probably be sponsors rather than the maker, I suppose. If so have a look here:

http://www.chrishobbs.com/horatiobrightfamily.htm

David

Thats a great bit of research David, the link to Isaac Bright and Mary Micholls (1786) looks promising, "Bright and Sons" being the retailer ?? mid Vic period ?.

Mick :)

wellington03
22-10-08, 06:27 PM
This is a new wostenholm pruner knife i have. One of my favourite knives.

Measures 8 1/4" fully opened.

http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/1706/sarah612qd5.jpg

Another superb knife Andy, of a pattern we have not seen before the "farmer jack", it having a pruning blade at the one end and a spey at the other.

Looks in wonderful condition, super stag, a pretty desirable knife

Mick :)

dkonopinski
23-10-08, 08:34 AM
Looks in wonderful condition, super stag, a pretty desirable knife

Mick :)

Understatement :lol: ...and I'm not even into pruners.

David

dkonopinski
23-10-08, 08:54 AM
Thats a great bit of research David, the link to Isaac Bright and Mary Micholls (1786) looks promising, "Bright and Sons" being the retailer ?? mid Vic period ?.

Thanks, Mick. I just wish I had the time to investigate further. My hints and possibilities are all very well, but some evidence and facts would be nice. Ah well. Gotta earn a crust, I suppose.

David

Lightning22
23-10-08, 10:03 PM
Any interest in a Rogers sheath knife? I know the thread is for folders but I just dug this out of an old tool box.

Rich

wellington03
23-10-08, 10:17 PM
Any interest in a Rogers sheath knife? I know the thread is for folders but I just dug this out of an old tool box.

Rich

Hi Rich

Sounds rather intriguing !, post a pic, if pos

Thanks Mick

wellington03
23-10-08, 10:36 PM
Since we have recently been discussing pruners, I would just like to add a pic of a fixed blade pruner, made for trade, for comparison.

JOSEPH RODGERS AND SONS G(crown)R, CUTLERS TO HIS MAJESTY. 4 1/2" blade. Trade knife, coffee tea ? pruner. Marked PATENT HANDLE INDIA no 23262. CEYLON no 2020. (Rev No 36 4 1/2" )

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/453994b7.jpg


Mick

RodgersLad
23-10-08, 11:11 PM
Again, thanks for the info on the knives you two. Really helps me.

Great pruner Mick, no better time than to show my two is there?

http://img505.imageshack.us/img505/1773/sarah537xr4.jpg

Lightning22
23-10-08, 11:23 PM
A few pics of the sheath knife.

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x119/Bungle10/Picture001.jpg

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x119/Bungle10/Picture002.jpg

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x119/Bungle10/Picture003.jpg

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x119/Bungle10/Picture004.jpg

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x119/Bungle10/Picture005.jpg

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x119/Bungle10/Picture006.jpg

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x119/Bungle10/Picture007.jpg

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x119/Bungle10/Picture008.jpg

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x119/Bungle10/Picture009.jpg

This one was my Dads knife.

Rich
;)

Ps. Just cleaning up a straight razor from the same box.....

RodgersLad
23-10-08, 11:45 PM
Ahhh william rodgers clip point bowie.

Dates to around 1950's? Carbon steel blade, not terribly rare.

Does it have a leather sheath? It would have originally.

Andy

Lightning22
24-10-08, 12:06 AM
I didn't think I was going to retire on the proceeds!

I do remember a sheath though I've no idea where it is, I have a 'stag' handled bowie somewhere that's been buried in multiple house moves.

Rich
;)

wellington03
24-10-08, 09:20 AM
Again, thanks for the info on the knives you two. Really helps me.

Great pruner Mick, no better time than to show my two is there?

http://img505.imageshack.us/img505/1773/sarah537xr4.jpg

Hi Andy, two excellent, large beech wood ? handled ,coffee or bean cutting, trade knives. How exactly are the knives marked ?, do you think my less well made example could be an Indian made version ? ( having the India and Ceylon pat no's)

Thanks for showing us the WR clip point Bowie Rich, it looks a nice example.

Mick :)

zorro
24-10-08, 08:49 PM
This one was my Dads knife.

Rich
;)


Every 1960's schoolboys dream knife, thanks for showing. :)

RodgersLad
25-10-08, 11:06 AM
Hi Andy, two excellent, large beech wood ? handled ,coffee or bean cutting, trade knives. How exactly are the knives marked ?, do you think my less well made example could be an Indian made version ? ( having the India and Ceylon pat no's)

Thanks for showing us the WR clip point Bowie Rich, it looks a nice example.

Mick :)

Mick, yes the handles are beech.

The knives are marked G crown R joseph rodgers & sons cutlers to his majesty 6 norfolk street sheffield england.

I'm afraid i know little about these knives Mick. I actually dont think the two knives i have were made for the trade, i have seen them in catalogues to buy individually before. But i think maybe your knife was made for the trade which explains the marks of india and ceylon, i mean i guess that tells us that was the place they were heading for?

Andy

Smiling-Knife
25-10-08, 11:30 AM
Thanks for showing your knife Rich. It is always special to have one with a family history. Interesting fixed blade prunners guys. I've seen them referred to as 'Plantation' knives... I assume for harvesting tea and the like. As we're on the fixed -blade theme I have these two. I probably showed them before in another thread. Does anyone have any information on Spider brand knives?

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q265/smiling-knife/Pruners.jpg
http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q265/smiling-knife/Spider.jpg

RodgersLad
25-10-08, 01:32 PM
^^ i have an unused rodgers one of these with a polished rosewood handle.

I was told these were called carpet knives, do you know if thats true?

Andy

wellington03
25-10-08, 01:32 PM
Mick, yes the handles are beech.

The knives are marked G crown R joseph rodgers & sons cutlers to his majesty 6 norfolk street sheffield england.

I'm afraid i know little about these knives Mick. I actually dont think the two knives i have were made for the trade, i have seen them in catalogues to buy individually before. But i think maybe your knife was made for the trade which explains the marks of india and ceylon, i mean i guess that tells us that was the place they were heading for?

Andy

Hi Andy, thanks for the info.

I have seen a pic showing 21 JR & s trade knives, each knife with a single edge, flat ground blade and beech handle, all made with different hook bill points, long and short blades. I can see examples very similar to your own.


Does anyone have any information on Spider brand knives?


Two excellent knives Steve, both well marked. I have looked hard for a reference to the "Spider" brand knife and, so far, have been unable to turn anything up. Bit of a mystery ?

Thanks for showing

Mick :)

Me&Fe
25-10-08, 05:17 PM
Hoping someone on here can help with an old sheffield maker.I have an army jack knife and all i can make out of the makers stamp is:----roon?&-----?There is also a tiny picture of a chello/doublebass/violin?Anyone know this one?Thanks.:)

zorro
25-10-08, 05:21 PM
Hoping someone on here can help with an old sheffield maker.I have an army jack knife and all i can make out of the makers stamp is:----roon?&-----?There is also a tiny picture of a chello/doublebass/violin?Anyone know this one?Thanks.:)

George Ibberson & Co. :)

Me&Fe
25-10-08, 05:29 PM
Thank you very much!This thread is just amazing.:) :)

zorro
27-10-08, 11:22 PM
I've copied these images posted by Erimus1066 from his thread "Old Sheffield knife maker", http://www.britishblades.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67213, he's looking for info on the maker and I think it more likely he will find what he is after here.

http://i451.photobucket.com/albums/qq232/erimus1066/890a_3.jpg

http://i451.photobucket.com/albums/qq232/erimus1066/9bdd_3.jpg

Thanks for looking. :)

wellington03
28-10-08, 12:23 AM
Hi Dave, thanks for posting pictures of Erimus1066's very interesting old knife.

As we can clearly see the knife is marked W M JACKSON & CO, SHEAF ISLAND WORKS, SHEFFIELD.

The main claim to fame associated with Wm. Jackson, is the fact that after Abraham Lincoln was assassinated at Ford's Theater, a knife was found on the stage with the William Jackson stamp. This was a spearpoint Bowie knife with "RIO GRANDE CAMP KNIFE" out on the blade.

Goins gives circa dates for Jackson of 1850-1860,

The blade looks to be well worn and sunk down into the well as we can't see a nail mark ?, it also looks to have been re-pinned.

I think the knife was made pre the American Civil War.

A very nice item

Mick :)

Erimus1066
28-10-08, 12:59 AM
Hello, I would like to point out that I do not own this knife!
I needed some info on it as It is up for sale, however since it is looking to be far older than I thought, I feel that it will probably be out of my price range!
Thanks to every one for the input

Erimus1066
28-10-08, 01:14 AM
http://i451.photobucket.com/albums/qq232/erimus1066/7b20_3-1.jpg[/IMG]

wellington03
29-10-08, 06:24 PM
William the fourth 1830-1837 combination letter opener and blade. MOP and in great condition for age.

Hard to get a picture of the marks but it says W crown R RODGERS CUTLERS TO THEIR MAJESTIES PATENT.

http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/2944/sarah503ct4.jpg

Hi Andy, I have been looking at the pictures of your WR IV J R & S pearl desk letter opener /knife, it really is a superb example.

For comparison here is a much later, but still reasonable quality ivory spatula ended desk letter opener with one pen blade, tang marked HUMPHREY'S, RADIANT, SHEFFIELD Circa 1890 Length 6".

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/2580a1ef.jpg

Mick

Smiling-Knife
29-10-08, 06:56 PM
Thanks for showing those beautiful office knives guys. Does the paddle also double as a page turner?

wellington03
29-10-08, 07:26 PM
Thanks for showing those beautiful office knives guys. Does the paddle also double as a page turner?

Hi Steve

Pleased you like the letter openers, don't really know very much about them. Andy's pearl example is, very early, a beautifully made thing, quite short in length.

I guess the paddle could be used as a page turner, my knife is/looks pretty tough ( ish ).


Mick :)

RodgersLad
30-10-08, 03:39 PM
Hmmm maybe they are meant to double up as page turners.

Really like your ivory example Mick,

Andy

dkonopinski
30-10-08, 03:44 PM
Could it even be a physician's spatula? "Open wide and say AAAAAH." I think they used to be called a tongue depressor. Obviously it would have to be before the age of hygenic disposables and would require a receptical of Dettol to hand, like the old "Nit Nurse's" steel combs.

David

mito0
31-10-08, 03:29 AM
i'm sure these wouldn't be considered "vintage" per se, but i've always thought they were graceful little things.

i can't imagine they're worth much, but i enjoy them a lot and am always on the lookout for more.

the two larger knives were made after the rodgers/wostenholm merger (1971 i think?). i'm guessing the smaller one is a little older.

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii268/RumoredTTSN/100_3369.jpg

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii268/RumoredTTSN/100_3370.jpg

anyone have some rodgers catalogs that might identify these by model number?

the large lambfoot with the long nail pull still has its original packaging which has a sticker reading "61W" which i guess is the model number for that one.

how would you classify the smaller one? trev ablett makes a similarly-shaped blade and calls it a farmer's knife, but i don't know what rodgers called it, or what it was specifically designed to do. it's hard to make out due to the angle of the photo, but the edge of the blade lies below the level of the tang (and probably originally extended even further - i'd guess the edge of the blade has lost at least 1/16" to sharpening). this was accomplished with a "hump" on the inside of the backspring which hit the tang before the edge could impact with the rest of the spring. i've never seen this feature on another pocket knife. i rather like the hard angles and straight lines of the blade contrasted with the gentle curves and round edges of the handle.
the fact that all of these knives have no visible pins certainly satisfies the minimalist in me.
:)

TOM STRATTON
31-10-08, 03:45 AM
Two blade victorian pen/quill made by Bright & Sons of sheffield. Does anyone have any info on this maker please? Ivory scale, silver shield.

2nd knfe is J.Torrill? 250 Regents st, sheffield.

http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/1783/sarah616es4.jpg

http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/5787/sarah619wr6.jpg

http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/460/sarah620nk2.jpg

Very nice I may try that filework style just to see if I can do it.Enjoy this thread so much.Thanks Guys

TOM STRATTON
31-10-08, 03:58 AM
Mick,
Wow on the Tortise shell Pearl knife you posted.I am running behind on this thread.The corn knives I talked about were more of a homemade straight knife.Probably made by a local blacksmith.Every week or so I go to this thread and see what you fellows come up with and am amazed every time.
I am cataloging some of the pics to see if I can work them in on some special projects of my own customizing.Thanks so much for sharing.

Tom

sebago
31-10-08, 12:14 PM
Tom,

The design that you see on the backspring of the "Torrill?" knife, is NOT filework. It is actually an "overlay." This is merely the result of passing narrow strips of thin nickel silver through a small press. The press has a hardened wheel with the design cut into it.

The nickel silver strip is rolled through the press causing the design to be pressed into the strip. The strips could be bought from the supply factor by the foot. (or whatever?) It was then cut to the desired length and mounted onto the backspring. Such overlays are more often found on folding fruit knives.

Nickel silver ferrules were formed in the same way. They, too could be purchased by the foot (or whatever?)

Close examination of such knives on the END of the backspring, with high magnification, will reveal the truth of this matter.

Jim Taylor.

wellington03
31-10-08, 08:45 PM
Mick,
Wow on the Tortise shell Pearl knife you posted.I am running behind on this thread.The corn knives I talked about were more of a homemade straight knife.Probably made by a local blacksmith.Every week or so I go to this thread and see what you fellows come up with and am amazed every time.
I am cataloging some of the pics to see if I can work them in on some special projects of my own customizing.Thanks so much for sharing.

Tom

Hi Tom,

Delighted you like some of the knives shown, some very stylish and attractive knives of late. :)

Looking forward to see what related ideas you can work into your future knives.


Tom,

The design that you see on the backspring of the "Torrill?" knife, is NOT filework. It is actually an "overlay." This is merely the result of passing narrow strips of thin nickel silver through a small press. The press has a hardened wheel with the design cut into it.

The nickel silver strip is rolled through the press causing the design to be pressed into the strip. The strips could be bought from the supply factor by the foot. (or whatever?) It was then cut to the desired length and mounted onto the backspring. Such overlays are more often found on folding fruit knives.

Jim Taylor.

Thanks for the info on the back spring overlays Jim. !

Maybe this form of decorating the springs was started in the Georgian period ?.

I think some of the Georgian silver overlays (spiral) were hand engraved, but it must have been quite difficult and expensive ?.


i'm sure these wouldn't be considered "vintage" per se, but i've always thought they were graceful little things.

i can't imagine they're worth much, but i enjoy them a lot and am always on the lookout for more.

the two larger knives were made after the rodgers/wostenholm merger (1971 i think?). i'm guessing the smaller one is a little older.

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii268/RumoredTTSN/100_3369.jpg

Hi Mito0,

Thanks for showing us your later made Joseph Rodgers knives, I have no late catalogues and no information I can add to your descriptions, always interesting to see later made items, seeing how the trade evolved.

The very well known firm of Joseph Rodgers and Sons, at one time produced superb products, fabulous quality, making some of the finest knives ever made, what became of this illustrious firm ???.

In the 1960s the whole Sheffield cutlery trade was going through a period of inevitable entrenchment.

In the mid 60s JR & S purchased the firm Cooper and Sons (Sheffield) Ltd. JR & S left Pond Hill and moved into the Cooper & Sons St Marys Gate premises.

1971 JR & S purchased Wostenholms and moved to Guernsey Road.

1975 the combined firm Rodgers & Wostenholm was purchased by Richards.

The famous names became the property of the Imperial Knife Co.

1981 Rodgers Wostenholm moved to the Richards factory on Moore Street.

1985 Richards went bankrupt, equipment sold, factory demolished.

Eggington Group then took over the Rodgers and Wostenholm marks ( they had already acquired the G Ibberson and Co, mark), their main penknife factory, the Clarke's site ( 65 Garden st ) was renamed "Washington Works".

The combined ( Rodgers Wostenholm ibberson ) firm "Eggington Group" moved forward concentrating mainly on folders,using more synthetic materials and modern production methods, gaining extensive contracts with the MOD and foreign governments, also making commemorative items, stilettos etc.



Here is a pic of a rose wood scaled light pruner made mid 1940s

Rodgers, Sheffield, England 3 1/2".

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/4118d139.jpg

Mick :)

grace horne
31-10-08, 09:19 PM
Tom,

The design that you see on the backspring of the "Torrill?" knife, is NOT filework. It is actually an "overlay." This is merely the result of passing narrow strips of thin nickel silver through a small press. The press has a hardened wheel with the design cut into it.

The nickel silver strip is rolled through the press causing the design to be pressed into the strip. The strips could be bought from the supply factor by the foot. (or whatever?) It was then cut to the desired length and mounted onto the backspring. Such overlays are more often found on folding fruit knives.

Nickel silver ferrules were formed in the same way. They, too could be purchased by the foot (or whatever?)

Close examination of such knives on the END of the backspring, with high magnification, will reveal the truth of this matter.

Jim Taylor.

Jim,
Can you explain this again for me? A lot of my silver fruit knives have this silver strip. Previously, I've tried fixing a silver strip onto the steel with pressure but had no sucess. What am I doing wrong?

sebago
31-10-08, 09:50 PM
Grace,

Your question is one that I can't answer. I just don't know what the old timers used to "fix" the nickel silver strips to the backsprings. My wife and I have literally sold hundreds of Sheffield fruit knives and only once have we ever experienced a loose overlay.

As you likely know, the Sheffield (and Birmingham) cutlers also overlaid backsprings with sheet silver and even gold. By this I mean without any design thereon, just plain sheet. They clearly had an almost perfect way of securing these noble metals to the carbon backsprings, but I don't know how they did it. Damned annoying, but a fact nevertheless!

The custom knife makers over here have often questioned me about such things. For example: How did they inlay the fabulous designs made out of silver wire and ablone chips, into buffalo or tortoise shell handles? One particular maker has been working on this for quite some time and is now very close to success.

The ways of the ancients are very dear to me, but they are also very elusive! Take as another example, the unfathomable multi-pin pique work that they achieved. These are definitely lost arts today and I mourn their passing.

Perhaps a lady such as yourself, Grace, can rediscover the method used to fix the nickel silver strips to the backsprings? I can promise you one thing for sure. It's worth a few quid!!

Jim Taylor.

Danzo
31-10-08, 10:08 PM
Great posts, Jim, in a thread that never ceases to educate, fascinate and amaze.

:biggthump

Danzo

mito0
01-11-08, 02:52 AM
grace, i'm not sure what method you used, but i recently saw tony bose use a technique that might help. he calls it "tinning." he puts a thin, even coat of flux and solder on a piece of steel. then, he uses spring loaded clamps to affix the 2nd piece of metal, in this case nickel silver, on to the steel. next, he applies heat to the steel side with a small torch* to get the solder just barely flowing. the spring loaded clamps will mash the pieces of metal together as the solder softens. then, just leave it clamped and allow it to cool.

* note for the brits: NOT a flashlight! ;)

TOM STRATTON
01-11-08, 04:00 AM
Thanks for the info on the (file work) I use checkering files in various sizes for work on liners,etc.They come in different sizes of lines per inch.I thought maybe to try to get that crosshatch thing on a back spring. The soldering Idea sounds good and I have a bit of silver solder and a torch in my shop but am a little afraid of effecting the temper.

Mick,
I never throw away small pieces of pearl hoping to find some way to use it.That knife is very striking in its design,as I never saw one like it before.

bushmansedge
01-11-08, 04:25 AM
As an armourer I had an ex Cogswell and Harrison gunsmith as a teacher and he showed me on a "private" job how rolled silver was applied to the trigger guard of a fancy shotgun. The thin silver was laid against the steel and covered with a piece of leather before being tapped down with a soft hammer to pick up the profile of the guard. the guard and mating surface of the silver were then tinned with Very low melting point solder and resin flux, (He told me pure lard would work but "rosin" was better). The silver was then wrapped in place with some thin and rusty iron wire and small wedges of beech placed under every 2nd or 3rd coil. to apply pressure. The work was then heated very slowly from one end and as the solder showed "wet" at the edges the fame was moved along the work. Keeping a wet edge (no cooling) from end to end was apparently essential and when the whole piece had been covered the flux was cleaned off and the work oiled to prevent rust. There was no solder expressed from the joint as the tinning was thin, having been "wiped" with a moleskin cloth ( I have used lint free cotton 4 x 2 cloth for this and it works!). The method can be used for all sorts of metal overlay and as long a lots of low temperature heat is applied (I use an electric paint stripper) there is no risk to the springs. There are lo-temp lead free solders that work well on this and I now use a Eutectic brand of liquid flux (but have to soak the residue off for a couple of minutes in hot water or any steel wet by it willrust and pit badly). I hope this helps but will happily PM anyone who needs more on the subject. It is a really good way of applying decoration and there are wheels available that will apply some designs to silver or copper.

bushmansedge
01-11-08, 04:33 AM
Have you thought of using a parser and assorted templates to use up those shell off-cuts? You can even put them into guitar fretboards! Filing shell with home made emery boards of assorted shapes takes some time but the result is worth it. If you are going to do a lot of shell work it might be worth getting some fine diamond files.

sebago
01-11-08, 12:25 PM
Bushmansedge,

Thank you so much for your contribution. Being totally ham-fisted myself, your explanation sailed way over my head. Nevertheless, I'm certain that we have many members that are "stroking their chins" and muttering to themselves this morning?

For many years now, I have been of the opinion that these backspring overlays became a specialist "Little Mester" task, and that they would pre-attach these overlays and supply the trade with them. Probably through a wholesaler and in several sizes?

Several dozens of the recognised fruit knife makers obviously fitted these decorated backsprings. Many of them being identical. It therefore seems unlikely that they would each have specialist people that did this work? Why would they?

The way that Sheffield worked throughout the Victorian era leads one to believe that specialist outworkers would be the obvious creators? Just a guess, of course, but seeing that nobody (in the trade) is alive today with memories of the process, that is the best that we can do.

Jim Taylor.

wellington03
01-11-08, 02:25 PM
An intriguing insight into some of the old Sheffield working practices Jim !.

Thanks guys for all the very interesting answers to quite a sticky overlay question.

Grace, if you want N/S silver or even gold sheet applying to either carbon or stainless backsprings, there are ways and means, I can offer a little advice.




Here is a pic of what first appears to be a quill knife, but it has a modern stainless pen blade. Repro or new blade on old knife.

Also note the backspring, a little worn, would this be a machine or hand engraved strip ?

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/57ed0553.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/6000583f.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/a18ab80c.jpg

Mick :)

RodgersLad
01-11-08, 02:34 PM
What a beautiful little knife Mick. Very very nice.

Just sticking my nose in here, here is a decent pic i think of more of this work discussed before on a sheffield silver fruit knife.

http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/9526/img0538pe9.jpg

dkonopinski
02-11-08, 12:00 AM
You know, this thread has gone from strength to strength. Each time I think it's about to flag, up comes someone new, something new and interesting new insights. Thanks to every one who has posted.

Mick that little quill knife is gorgeous and Andy, that fruit knife pic was just what I needed to stir the ol' grey cells a bit. I've only 3 Sheffield fruit knives, all turn-of-the-century (19/20) and they've all just got unadorned springs. In fact, they're not only unadorned, but they're almost unspringy.

I'm fascinated by the concept of layering a metal like gold onto a steel spring. Why doesn't the flexing of the spring cause a problem? Also, during the process to bond the two metals, heat is applied. The metals will expand and contract at different rates by different amounts. I remember that much O-level physics. Why isn't that a problem? Can a thin sheet of any metal be bonded to a thicker piece of any other metal? Clearly, I don't understand some of the basics. I must dive into the BB knowledge base forums. That should keep me out of trouble for a bit.:)

David

TOM STRATTON
02-11-08, 12:58 AM
Have you thought of using a parser and assorted templates to use up those shell off-cuts? You can even put them into guitar fretboards! Filing shell with home made emery boards of assorted shapes takes some time but the result is worth it. If you are going to do a lot of shell work it might be worth getting some fine diamond files.

I just save them hoping to have a little time to do something pleasing.My son makes stringed instruments and could use them too.Thick 1 x 3 white MOP costs around 55 dollars per set now.I considered once about trying to make some type of jewelry.Thanks for the advice though.

grace horne
02-11-08, 11:32 AM
Jim, I accept that this decoration isn't filework...



...The design that you see on the backspring of the "Torrill?" knife, is NOT filework. It is actually an "overlay."

...what would you call it when describing a knife?

sebago
02-11-08, 01:12 PM
Grace,

We have always used the term "overlay." These are mostly of nickel silver, but, as mentioned, they might also be of sterling silver or gold.

Jim Taylor.

sebago
02-11-08, 01:39 PM
Grace,

Upon reflection, I realise that my answer is not exactly what you are seeking.

If I were making a written description of, say, a folding fruit knife, and when wishing to describe the backspring decoration, I would use the following terminology. You may wish to use something different?

"The nickel silver backspring overlay carries the crosscheck and ladder design."

This could then be amended to suit whatever the motif is. e.g. "zipper design." or, perhaps, "barley sugar twist." There are, as you likely know, several different overlay designs. I hope that this is helpful to you?

Jim Taylor.

zorro
02-11-08, 01:50 PM
You know, this thread has gone from strength to strength. Each time I think it's about to flag, up comes someone new, something new and interesting new insights. Thanks to every one who has posted.
David

I originally joined here to research old Sheffield folders, this thread has been (and still is) an inspiration. May I add my thanks and admiration as well? :)

Me&Fe
05-11-08, 11:00 AM
Hi all.Pictured is my new find..its made by Southern&Richardson,Sheffield.The scales are sterling silver and are hallmarked for london 1901.Could someone tell me what sort of knife this is?A smokers knife?What is the two pronged fork like tool for.I know the device on the left hand end is a cigar cutter.Also the spike on the bottom was possibly longer.Any help would be greatly appreciated!http://i483.photobucket.com/albums/rr197/MeAndFe/PICT1923.jpg

grace horne
05-11-08, 11:11 AM
A smokers knife?What is the two pronged fork like tool for.I know the device on the left hand end is a cigar cutter.Also the spike on the bottom was possibly longer.Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Yep, looks like a cigar smokers knife to me. The two pronged fork is for stabbing them (so that you dont need to pick the filthy things up with your fingers...:D )

Me&Fe
05-11-08, 11:15 AM
You dont know what its for then..:rolleyes:

grace horne
05-11-08, 11:43 AM
You dont know what its for then..:rolleyes:

:lol:

Ok...I gather that it's for pricking the cigars, although I couldn't tell you why you'd need to!

dkonopinski
05-11-08, 01:02 PM
:lol:

Ok...I gather that it's for pricking the cigars, although I couldn't tell you why you'd need to!

I think it's a way to hold a very short cigar end and smoke out the last bit of it.

David

bushmansedge
05-11-08, 01:20 PM
Weren't cigars totally covered by a wrapping leaf of "highest grade" tobacco to retain the required moisture and oils? Then the cutter removed the end where the fire was applied and the spike was used to pierce the mouth end to allow the smoke out into the mouthe and lungs. The fork was to get the last half inch of value (and concentrated nasties?) into the lungs without burning fingers or lips. The volume of a glowing cigar tip holds an amazing amount of heat.

Me&Fe
05-11-08, 05:21 PM
Thanks!Intresting and disgusting!!

wellington03
06-11-08, 02:17 AM
As we approach the 1000 th post !.

I would like to take this opportunity to thank ALL the members who have posted pictures of some of their fine knives on this thread, Steve (S-K), Andy (Rodgers Lad), David (Dkonopinski), Dave (Zorro), Grace, Steve (N/S), Mark (AndrewThoma) Jim (Bushmansedge), Me&Fe, Rich (Lightning22) Steve111, Mito0 and Paul (Grangerknives) Hope I havn't missed anyone out :rolleyes: .

And I would like to thank everybody else for chipping in with advice or comments, etc.


http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh177/wellington03/45189616.jpg


I have added an index, showing all three hundred odd knives shown to date, on pg 1

http://www.britishblades.com/forums/showpost.php?p=811134&postcount=1

Mick :)

RodgersLad
06-11-08, 02:28 AM
Thanks for doing that list Mick, great reference.

This really is a great thread. I think we do the old cutlers proud in here.

Andy