Scottish Knife Dealers Licence scheme now enforced.

[651bobby]

I would love that idea if it meant I could carry a locking +3" knife without fear of being given 6 months in jail. It keeps the harsh penalties in place for the people that need them, and allows a sense of trust for the trustworthy. At least it would be a compromise on 'sharp = bad, sharp = jail'.

No they are not suddenly going to let poeple with licenses carry what they want, if anything with that will go the 3" slippy rule.

[Macdonald]

Just posted my required wording in the armouries today -



RED TAPE ALERT!


The Scottish Executive in association with the City of Edinburgh Council has decided in their unquestionable wisdom that the following wording must be displayed here to help keep us all safe and sleep better at night -

It is an offence to sell to a person under the age of 18 any knife or knife blade (except if the person is aged 16 or over and the knife or blade is designed for domestic use);
It is also an offence to sell to a person under the age of 18 any razor blade, axe, sword or other article which has a blade or which is sharply pointed and which is made or adapted for use for causing injury; and
a customer may also be asked to provide details of his/her age and identity (which may be recorded or copied and kept for inspection for up to three years).

Macdonald Armouries would like to apologise to any under 18's that may be offended by the above legislative judgements upon your better sensibilities, background, and intentions.

We hope you continue to enjoy our products, martial culture and history and uphold the right to own, use and appreciate well crafted blades of any form.



Paul Macdonald,
Proprietor and Swordmaker,
Macdonald Armouries

[Basemetal]

Hi Paul, I've got three questions
1. How is non-domestic defined? Domestic cattle don't stay in the house and domestic wine just isn't foreign.
2. To what extent can we say "martial" and "made or adapted for use for causing injury" are irrelevant to most of the knives we deal with on BB, regardless of size?
3. What is the jurisdiction of this "Scottish Executive in assocation Edinburgh City Council" decision? Is it a city by-law?

Danny

[ANDYLASER]

Reading your declaration, it would appear that a 17 year old scout cannot buy a camping knife, but a 16 year old chav can buy a kitchen devil mugging implement.

It would also appear to be illegal to buy drawing pins and cocktail sticks.

[Macdonald]

Hi Danny,

Thanks for the questions. In answer -

1 - The categorisation of domestic/non domestic with regard to knives is a legislative invention. If it came to defining any specific blade, that would be for a court to decide.
2 - To firstly be clear on what part of my posted text is required by law to display on premises -
It is an offence to sell to a person under the age of 18 any knife or knife blade (except if the person is aged 16 or over and the knife or blade is designed for domestic use);
It is also an offence to sell to a person under the age of 18 any razor blade, axe, sword or other article which has a blade or which is sharply pointed and which is made or adapted for use for causing injury; and
a customer may also be asked to provide details of his/her age and identity (which may be recorded or copied and kept for inspection for up to three years).

All other text is my own addition, that includes the term martial.

"made or adapted for use for causing injury" could be percieved as any knife! Again, definitions are decided by courts in specific cases.

3 - This is not just a city by-law, but now applies to all businesses in Scotland selling or hiring any "non-domestic" blades over 3.5" I referenced Edinburgh City Council, as my armouries is in that city.

Hope this helps.

[Macdonald]

Reading your declaration, it would appear that a 17 year old scout cannot buy a camping knife, but a 16 year old chav can buy a kitchen devil mugging implement.

It would also appear to be illegal to buy drawing pins and cocktail sticks.

Hi Andy,

It is already illegal to sell any blade in the UK to anyone under 18. The new knife dealers licence now means that I am legally required to have a clear sign displayed at the entrance to the premises.

The legislation requires that it "contain" the required legislative wording, so I included a bit of our own either side...

Drawing pins and cocktail sticks would be under 3.5" and also regarded as domestic blades.
Mind you, can still give you a nasty nip!

[Basemetal]

I helps, but it depresses me greatly
The terms "made for causing injury" or "adapted to cause injury" seem to address intent, rather than physical attributes of an object. They would apply to the sort of american battle fantasy cutlery we see - but not necessarily to a 15" billhook. I see work for lawyers until precedents nail everything down. Badly.

[JimN]

New weapons law will harm fencing, archery

ARCHERY’S World Cup Final will be staged in Edinburgh’s Princes Street in September.

It will have some 250m TV viewers, and is the most high-profile platform the sport has enjoyed in Scotland for centuries. Yet it may be the last after the Scottish Parliament yesterday failed to support three amendments presented by John Lamont MSP on behalf of the Scottish Sports Association.

King James II will surely be birling in his grave. In 1457 he banned golf because it undermined archery practice. Now, 553 years on, the sport fears it is being unfairly targeted, while fencing and field archery may also be compromised by MSP’s refusal to put SSA amendments to the vote.

The Custodial Sentence and Weapons (Scotland) Act 2007 has potentially terminal implications for law-abiding fencers, archers, and field archers.

Though Holyrood agreed to look at the sport lobby’s concerns, there is no time frame or mechanism for this.

The sports bodies support the Act which they perceive is in the best interests of society, but say labelling ancient sports alongside knife crime is unfair. Pistol shooting has already been almost wiped out as a viable sport due to UK gun legislation.

The SSA sought exemption in the licensing mechanismn for equipment dealers which they fear will seriously impact on the accessibility of all three sports.

Equipment vendors sell weapons and blades at events all over the country. They require a ‘knife dealer’s license’ for their “normal place of business” but now will also need an additional licence for every other event. They must apply for these separately and individually in each local authority area. The cost could run to £5000 for a single dealer, making the trade uneconomical.

A licence is needed for anyone selling, hiring, offering for sale or hire, exposing for sale or hire, lending, or giving a blade. Scottish Fencing fears costs may stop vendors attending events, the most natural place to purchase kit. “By imposing licensing fees on vendors and therefore limiting the availability of equipment, participants in the fencing world will be unfairly discriminated against,” said a spokesman.

Fencing enjoys an exception in some areas, making it least hardest hit. But arrows are listed with blades such as fencing swords. Holyrood refused an amendment proposal for arrows to be similarly classified and exempted.

This will put many archery clubs at risk. Many survive on “come-and-try” days at fetes and galas. Every one of these will now require to purchase a knife dealer’s license.

Purchasing of arrows is specialised and few providers exist. It’s feared the bureau*cratic process will threaten the sport in the long run.

The world’s leading 16 male and female archers are due in the capital, and several “come-and-try” events are planned. Scottish Archery say the regulations put these at risk, with Edinburgh Council entitled to demand a licence fee from every dealer.

The SSA suggest this is an unjust expectation on legitimate sports goods dealers, “who exist to allow the people of Scotland to participate in these sports”.

Private businesses may pay £5000 simply to trade, but clubs will pay a higher price. “Fencing and archery clubs in Scotland exist thanks to volunteers: their hard work and time,” say the SSA. “Cutting their access to equipment is the death knell for the sports in Scotland – two Olympic sports crushed by legislation.”

But the SSA still “look forward to working towards a solution that supports the fencers and archers of Scotland”.

[MeetTheGeeks]

such a shame the rights of the people are taken by those who have never tried any of the sports or found pleasure in the art of creation... we need a civil uprising to make governments afraid of us once again.

[fluffy]

such a shame the rights of the people are taken by those who have never tried any of the sports or found pleasure in the art of creation... we need a civil uprising to make governments afraid of us once again.

We have one every 5 years called an election.
Become a vocal minority: talk to your MP

[MeetTheGeeks]

I want something done its no good talking to them

[fluffy]

They are lawmakers.
Get support and talk to them.
Right now the mood exists that says the previous Government was overregulating our lives.
Talk to the people who can do something about it