Spyderco Native Slipjoint

[xavierdoc]

Xav - that is a most interesting categorisation.

But are we overstepping here, guys? Sure, if you had one helluva folding-locker with a 'Schwarzenegger' pivot, then exotics like M390 are justified.

But this is a wee 3" non-locker - something that will probably handle and suit S30V for 99% of us more than adequately. Anyone 'needing' M390 will have a knife fit-for-purpose.

- no?

I don't see what the pivot strength has to do with it? A high end steel like M390/S90v/Rex-121 etc would be perfectly reasonable in a small folder due to the excellent wear resistance. In fact, I think most of these steels do not perfom well in Charpy tests of impact resistance. The fact that they can or have been used in larger blades does not negate their use in smaller knives. I would argue the opposite.

Perhaps the main reason I would like a "super-steel" is because there are no Spyderco slippies that have a high-end steel offering but there are cheaper/functional steels in the form of various UKPK FRNs and Byrd Wings Slipit/Tern. That choice has been offered for some time. There are plenty of locking Spydies that have top end steels (usually sprints but not hard to get if you are on the ball) but I can't EDC these.

Ironically, it is in a UK-legal EDC knife that the edge-holding of a high-carbide, micro-clean steel would be most appealling. If I carry a locking Spydie sprint with fancy steel then it is because I have a specific use that justifies the carrying of a locking knife. This is, by definition, a limited period which will almost invariably allow resharpening at the end of use. On the other hand, a a sub 3" slippy might go through weeks of pocket time and daily use before I make a point of resharpening. The longer it holds a good edge, the better -less sharpening. YMMV, as they say!

Of course, future Native Slippy Sprints might remedy that if a cheaper steel was used in the production run.

On a different tack, I'd love a UK legal EDC slippy in H1 (or equivalent) as there isn't a suitable option that I'm aware of (please enlighten me if you know otherwise.) Althought H1 isn't the best for edge-retention, I find it easy to maintain a good edge and it is tough. Sadly, H1 is not going to be an option if Sal wants a USA-made steel.

With respect to S30/35VN: in use, I can't detect a significant difference between S30V and S35VN, so in that circumstance I'd opt for the cheapest.

[Danzo]

Having read through all the comments here I'll offer my two pennorth.

I believe that a part of the ethos of the Slipit range is that the knives should be affordable, although that is of course a very relative concept. But for people to be suggesting very rare and expensive supersteels on the basis that "they go up to 11" is plain daft.

What better way to kill the potential of a project by only making it affordable to a few elitist collectors and steel snobs? And yes, I acknowledge that some of you will use the knife as well, before the complaints flood in.



I'd make the first run from S30V as it has a great heritage with the Native family.

I want the knife to be a success, and be affordable to as many people as possible. If the knife succeeds then there is probably scope for sprint runs in interesting steels. But let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater by asking for a £500 knife made from Unobtanium.

Danzo

[xavierdoc]

Having read through all the comments here I'll offer my two pennorth.

I believe that a part of the ethos of the Slipit range is that the knives should be affordable, although that is of course a very relative concept. But for people to be suggesting very rare and expensive supersteels on the basis that "they go up to 11" is plain daft.

What better way to kill the potential of a project by only making it affordable to a few elitist collectors and steel snobs? And yes, I acknowledge that some of you will use the knife as well, before the complaints flood in.



I'd make the first run from S30V as it has a great heritage with the Native family.

I want the knife to be a success, and be affordable to as many people as possible. If the knife succeeds then there is probably scope for sprint runs in interesting steels. But let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater by asking for a £500 knife made from Unobtanium.

Danzo

I think £500 is being alarmist, Dan.

Affordable is good but is also well catered for in the Slipit range. I agree that it is important for the knife to be successful but if the UKPK is an indication, then an S30v blade in G10 is going to be a £100+ knife already (doubtless MUCH cheaper in the US). This puts it firmly in the "knife afficionado/collector/enthusiast" territory and will be out of the clutches of many of those, too.

It might make sense for the first run to be even more basic (steel wise) if "large" sales are required to secure the popularity and longevity of the Native slippy. People like me (steel snobs!) could then wait for sprint runs of more exotic steel.

[Hellz]

Unobtainium? Wow, that sounds awesome, lets have that!

[Danzo]

It might make sense for the first run to be even more basic (steel wise) if "large" sales are required to secure the popularity and longevity of the Native slippy. People like me (steel snobs!) could then wait for sprint runs of more exotic steel.

Indeed Doc.

I'd be happy with Gin1 or 440C or whatever from the Spyderco stable. And as I said, I have no idea what the proto is made of. I suspect that Sal may not know either!

I would love to see the Native Slipjoint in an absolutely elite steel, the knife has been a project for me in my own little way for a long time, I want the best for it. But I would much rather see the knife as an all round success, and most importantly sell, sell to lots and lots of people.

But that's just me

Danzo

[Stew]

OK.... convince me! It's not a steel for a blade that I've owned yet

Why does M4 "rock"?

High performance steel with soul! stainless gets a bit boring. It tells no story. I love my carbon steel kitchen knives, showing the different colours depending what they've cut. I know m4 is not going to happen though. It'll be a stainless.

Personally I would like to see elmax or cts-xhp, in that order.

[The General]

I like 11, it's one higher than 10 and we all know that is better!

[Hepotec]

I'd like the blade to be made from steel and the handle from something that's nice to hold.

[Toast]

High performance steel with soul! stainless gets a bit boring. It tells no story. I love my carbon steel kitchen knives, showing the different colours depending what they've cut. I know m4 is not going to happen though. It'll be a stainless.

This.

I agree completely with Danzo & folks that we shouldn't argue to make it stupidly expensive & damn the project before it hits the shelves, and likewise I think a non-stainless would put off casual users as they'd err in favour of low-maintenance, stainless blades. But I've been sort-of viewing the BB forum knife as a sprint run, and using a different steel in the blade wouldn't require re-engineering but would make it very different to a production model.

If a production model came out in the same steel but different scales, I'd not buy it if I already owned a forum branded knife - if I really wanted another colour, I can make scales. I can't engineer a replacement blade, though! If I owned an M4 or similar forum knife, I may eventually buy a production knife in S30V or similar as well.

Also, I doubt orange G10 would remain exclusive to the forum knife, and if it did then potentially that would cost Spyderco sales of the main production run from folk not wanting another black knife. Orange is a popular colour to try & lay claim to! An exclusive steel to the forum knife, however, would have much less impact on retail sales down the line.

I hope I've made sense, even though I doubt I'll convince you all in the end

[renton]

I'd like the blade to be made from steel and the handle from something that's nice to hold.

What about flint for the blade?

[ChrisR]

I totally agree with Danzo in that it must be successful and affordable to the widest audience - I don't have much cash to throw around these days and I'm relatively fortunate - at least I'm not on benefits or a basic pension. I just think that if Sal could give us an idea how different steels affect the price then we might be pleasantly surprised ... or we'd at least know that (for example) CTS-BD1 was the only affordable solution

[Relin]

This.

I agree completely with Danzo & folks that we shouldn't argue to make it stupidly expensive & damn the project before it hits the shelves, and likewise I think a non-stainless would put off casual users as they'd err in favour of low-maintenance, stainless blades. But I've been sort-of viewing the BB forum knife as a sprint run, and using a different steel in the blade wouldn't require re-engineering but would make it very different to a production model.

If a production model came out in the same steel but different scales, I'd not buy it if I already owned a forum branded knife - if I really wanted another colour, I can make scales. I can't engineer a replacement blade, though! If I owned an M4 or similar forum knife, I may eventually buy a production knife in S30V or similar as well.

Also, I doubt orange G10 would remain exclusive to the forum knife, and if it did then potentially that would cost Spyderco sales of the main production run from folk not wanting another black knife. Orange is a popular colour to try & lay claim to! An exclusive steel to the forum knife, however, would have much less impact on retail sales down the line.

I hope I've made sense, even though I doubt I'll convince you all in the end

I thought Sal had already said it would be orange?

Sent from my GT-I9000 using Tapatalk

[Danzo]

I thought Sal had already said it would be orange?

Sent from my GT-I9000 using Tapatalk

Indeed he did, and I think he's talking about the standard production slipjoint Native, not a specific BB forum knife.

Danzo

[Stew]

I'd like the blade to be made from steel and the handle from something that's nice to hold.

Wise words as ever Hep!

I've thought about this and realistically, I don't care what steel it is - like Chris I would prefer to be able to afford the knife.
I suspect that I can't tell the difference between most steels. I like the idea of a fancy steel but as long as it's a good steel, it'll be good enough.

I don't want some rubbish steel as I want it to hold up to constant use and carry, afterall the plan will be it gets used a lot, but not too good a steel that it'll never get used because I can't buy it in the first place!

[Uriel]

What about flint for the blade?

Nah. It's a Spyderco knife, innit? If we're gonna go old school, it's still got to be something special, so I vote obsidian.