Knives and camping

[chetan]

Hi guys,

I'm new to this forum and after reading a lot of threads still confused about the UK law.
I'm Dutch and planning a camping trip to Devon/Dartmoor. Usually on such a trip I take a fixed blade (F1 or Esee Izula) and a folding knive (Benchmade griptillian or Spyderco Native). Can I get into trouble with these knives while hiking?

I appriciate your help!

[Chui]

Big welcome to BB

The law in UK is that you cannot legally carry anything beyond a 3" cutting edge non-locking folder - without good reason.

If you are specifically hiking and camping; you do not wear it at all times in an extrovert manner/draw attention to it/'flash it about' and are generally discrete with how you use it in the company of others...........I would suggest that you will be fine, it is 'good reason'.

No doubt there will be others to post their opinions and offer advice..........

[rd6743]

Big welcome to BB

The law in UK is that you cannot legally carry anything beyond a 3" cutting edge non-locking folder - without good reason.

If you are specifically hiking and camping; you do not wear it at all times in an extrovert manner/draw attention to it/'flash it about' and are generally discrete with how you use it in the company of others...........I would suggest that you will be fine, it is 'good reason'.

No doubt there will be others to post their opinions and offer advice..........

Not much for me to add (even though what I've learnt is from the forum)! Hope you have a good time here too.

[kungaryfu]

I recently spent a weekend wild camping on dartmoor and brought a 100mm bladed mora and a condor kumunga whith a ten inch blade, i kept them both deep within my backpack until i got to our camp area and then used them all weekend with no worries as i had a good reason to have them with me. As long as you act sensibly and dont go waving it about or acting in an aggresive manner, (wich you obviously wont be doing) you will have no problems whatsoever.

[RamblerUK]

You'll find a lot of answers on this forum regarding this subject from a lot of people that know there stuff. I've read pages of the stuff on BB and other websites, which is all adequate info, but for my own peace of mind I decided to ring my local police station. The person I spoke to on the phone said that we're allowed to carry a 3 inch (or less) non-locking blade, providing we have good use. As were all aware, non-locking knives have their limits. So I continued to ask about fixed blades. His answer was along the lines of 'When looking at knife laws, they're in the regards of youngsters who roam town/city centres with any sharp object on their person'. He then went on to explain how carrying knives is generally over looked when they're carried in the wilderness, especially if you have 15kg of camping gear with you. I asked whether or not it's advisable to wear the knife visible or carry it in a pack, he told me it doesn't matter because IF it's something we're not meant to carry, the law wouldn't look at it differently wherever the item was kept.

Anyway, I know information can sometimes be subjective and not all police are the same, but I'd say if you're safe and sensible you shouldn't have any worries. I've searched the internet for cases where campers have been prosecuted for carrying knives and I can't find anything, although it would be an interesting read if anyone has found an article on this!

[MeetTheGeeks]

The attitude of most people around Dartmoor itself is that you need a knife or a tool handy. If you walk onto the moor before putting a fixed blade onto your belt, or simply carry it in one of your cargo trouser pockets etc you will be fine. Most people carry them on the moor and no one bats an eye lid. Both myself and dave were carrying them in Drewsteignton village and the pub and no one cares.

If you need any help on dartmoor or a lift to some where to help with the camping let me know if I can help I will. Be sensible, country folk are down to earth and clued up but dont bring a shortsword.

The F1 will be fine. I can lend you one when you are here if it helps.

[kungaryfu]

Listen to meet the geeks he is the font of all knowledge on dartmoor, i went recently and he really helped me out, he is a really nice guy.

[Danzo]

You'll find a lot of answers on this forum regarding this subject from a lot of people that know there stuff. I've read pages of the stuff on BB and other websites, which is all adequate info, but for my own peace of mind I decided to ring my local police station. The person I spoke to on the phone said that we're allowed to carry a 3 inch (or less) non-locking blade, providing we have good use.

Which just goes to show that calling a police station to ask about knife law is a very bad idea. An awful lot of police officers are not very knowledgeable about knife laws yet are quite willing to participate in misinforming the public.

You do NOT need to be able to show a "good use" for carrying a non locking folder with a blade under three inches. Such knives are specifically exempt from the law. You can carry one just because you want to.

You do need to have a good reason for carrying any other sort of knife though. Camping is a as good a reason as you can get. I've searched the law reports over the years and have yet to find any case where a camper has been done for having a knife.

Danzo

[presterjohn]

Generally a country copper who deals with farmers and outdoor types in general will have a very different outlook to a town copper who might instead be dealing with pub fights and gangs. I doubt if that many big city coppers can be relied upon for good and accurate advice on the subject. If you stick to using knives were they are supposed to be used you should have few problems.

[MeetTheGeeks]

Listen to meet the geeks he is the font of all knowledge on dartmoor, i went recently and he really helped me out, he is a really nice guy.

Stop starting rumours

[chetan]

Thanks a lot for all your kind and helpfull replies!
I think I'll stick around a bit on this forum.

See you all on Dartmoor or some other wild place...

[RamblerUK]

Which just goes to show that calling a police station to ask about knife law is a very bad idea. An awful lot of police officers are not very knowledgeable about knife laws yet are quite willing to participate in misinforming the public.

You do NOT need to be able to show a "good use" for carrying a non locking folder with a blade under three inches. Such knives are specifically exempt from the law. You can carry one just because you want to.

You do need to have a good reason for carrying any other sort of knife though. Camping is a as good a reason as you can get. I've searched the law reports over the years and have yet to find any case where a camper has been done for having a knife.

Danzo

Thanks Danzo. Like I said police are subjective, it all depends on which police officer you catch and what mood they're in. But I didn't know that you DON'T need a good reason to carry a UK legal knife, so thanks for that

[Martyn]

You'll find a lot of answers on this forum regarding this subject from a lot of people that know there stuff. I've read pages of the stuff on BB and other websites, which is all adequate info, but for my own peace of mind I decided to ring my local police station. The person I spoke to on the phone said that we're allowed to carry a 3 inch (or less) non-locking blade, providing we have good use.

You see, police officers are not lawyers. They have an agenda and a working knowledge. They are an excellent source of information if you want to understand how and what the police do, but if you want to know the law, ask a lawyer. This point is made more apparent because the information you were given, is wrong. You do not need any reason at all to carry a 3 inch (or less) non-locking blade. You can carry one quite legally, purely because the fancy takes you. Your right to do that is protected in statute.

As were all aware, non-locking knives have their limits. So I continued to ask about fixed blades. His answer was along the lines of 'When looking at knife laws, they're in the regards of youngsters who roam town/city centres with any sharp object on their person'. He then went on to explain how carrying knives is generally over looked when they're carried in the wilderness, especially if you have 15kg of camping gear with you. I asked whether or not it's advisable to wear the knife visible or carry it in a pack, he told me it doesn't matter because IF it's something we're not meant to carry, the law wouldn't look at it differently wherever the item was kept.

Now we get to the agenda bit and this is where police officers are really useful people to talk to. Their agenda is keeping crime off the streets - not enforcing all laws for all men. Take particular note of that. Because what that police officer told you, was that if you are not a criminal, they couldn't really care less. This is where you get some "perspective" rather than getting bogged down with the syntax of statute books and it's worth it's weight in gold.

[chetan]

Thanks for your generous offer! I know why I love my holidays in the UK so much
I'll be there with people who know there way around there, so I'll be fine.

[Danzo]

Thanks Danzo. Like I said police are subjective, it all depends on which police officer you catch and what mood they're in. But I didn't know that you DON'T need a good reason to carry a UK legal knife, so thanks for that

No worries, and you are entirely correct about the police being subjective, it really couldn't be any other way and of course knife law is a fairly low priority in comparison to other legislation for most officers.

This term "UK legal knife" that we use here is perhaps becoming misleading. Almost all knives are legal in the UK, almost all are legal to carry with a good reason, or specific reasons such as requiring the knife for work, for national costume (think Scots) or for religious requirements (think Sikhs).

We use the term to mean those non locking folders with a cutting edge on the blade under 3" long which are specifically exempted from restriction by s139 of the Criminal Justice Act 1988. So the knives are "UK legal" because there is no legal restriction on their public carry anywhere in the UK.

Danzo