I*XL Wostenholm markings.

[OWDTOM]

I aquired a C.T. Bingham knife this weekend which bears the TALLY HO! mark, but I am struggling to find any information on the maker. Could you enlighten me any further Tom? Thank you.

I was interested to see your post and picture of the C.T. Bingham, all-metal, ring-opening, two-blade, because the knife most probably pre-dates 1891 which struck me as being much earlier than I would have thought for this style of easy opener to come onto the market.

I don't have a date when Bingham's ceased trading under their own name and the Tally-Ho mark was acquired by others - ultimately by Wostenholms.

Bit of a long shot, but I'll have a word with Geoffrey Tweedale on the off-chance that he just may have included the firm in his forthcoming book. I have to add - don't hold your breath!
T.

[zorro]

Bit of a long shot, but I'll have a word with Geoffrey Tweedale on the off-chance that he just may have included the firm in his forthcoming book. I have to add - don't hold your breath!
T.

Thank you Tom.

[yaro5]

Hi to the group!

I have an old IXL knife found metal detecting at an old mine site beside an historic town called Tigerville. The site dates back to the 1880's or prior, and has seen continuous habitation since then.

-Ed

Hi Ed,
If you can find a copy of the 1975 reprint of the 1885 George Wostenholm & Son catalogue, I think you will find a very similar knife shown on Plate 12, knife 7305. This knife is shown in stag with brass liners. It has a spearpoint main blade which I believe has a long pull opener (not clear in the catalogue) and a small secondary pen blade. Here is a scan. Not too sure how clear it will be though.

Joe

[OWDTOM]

Thank you Tom.

pm sent.
T

[EdG]

Thanks again Tom, for the additional details and thanks York for the catalog scan. 7305 is almost a perfect match, except my example has IXL on the large-end bolsters. The primary blade on mine does not have IXL stamped and the catalog doesn't show the tang of that blade,. I now see the smaller blade on my knife does have IXL, just barely visible in the rust. So, though not an exact match with the different bolsters, that might just be production variation. It apparently does date from circa 1885. I really appreciate knowing that!

Tom, you're correct in the head spring info. I took a dozen new photos and posted them to the link I gave earlier and added some captions, here it is again: http://www.whiteriverprep.com/IXL/index.html

Here's a few of the new pics:











Hopefully these aren't too large for comfortable forum display!

Thanks again for all the info.
-Ed

[OWDTOM]

[I don't have a date when Bingham's ceased trading under their own name and the Tally-Ho mark was acquired by others - ultimately by Wostenholms.

T.[/QUOTE]

I can now add that when C.T. Bingham ceased trading and closed down in 1863 the Tally Ho mark was acquired directly by Wostenholm's during that year. Quite often in Sheffield, cutlers' trade marks passed through the hands of intermediate owners, but not in this instance.

The rather odd thing about the Tally Ho mark is that no references can be found to show that it was used on open razors. Also, Bexfield dates the transfer of ownership of the mark to Wostenholm's as 1860 - others say 1863 is more likely.

In any event the little knife - or the blades at any rate - can now be safely dated to sometime betwixt 1852 to 1863.
T.

[wellington03]

The rather odd thing about the Tally Ho mark is that no references can be found to show that it was used on open razors.

Hi Tom,

There's a Wostenholm open razor box label shown on P.72 that displays the "Tally Ho" mark.

http://www.britishblades.com/forums/...=1#post1398128

Looking through the Cutlers Company's 1919 register of trade marks, two firms, George Wostenholms and Samuel Fox & Co have the Tally Ho ( & running fox logo) trade mark registered ?.

Mick

[OWDTOM]

Hi Tom,

There's a Wostenholm open razor box label shown on P.72 that displays the "Tally Ho" mark.

http://www.britishblades.com/forums/...=1#post1398128

Looking through the Cutlers Company's 1919 register of trade marks, two firms, George Wostenholms and Samuel Fox & Co have the Tally Ho ( & running fox logo) trade mark registered ?.

Mick

Now that, quite literally, is a real 'turn up for the book' Mick - thank you for the reminder. I say reminder because I'd seen the scans previously in that earlier thread, but failed to remember the advertising detail obviously.

G.T. will be delighted because when he replied to me about Bingham's a couple of days ago he followed with an addendum email saying that he hadn't been able to find any reference to the mark being used - on the ACTUAL razors by Wostenholm's that is - in terms of entry in their trade catalogues after the acquisition in 1863. The question now is that although the Tally Ho mark appeared on a box label, did it also feature on the razors the box contained. Logic would say 'yes', but from the catalogue pictures I've seen post 1885 , it doesn't. Intriguing!

Incidentally, I should be able to say more on the new book very shortly - possibly tomorrow.
T.

[benjiknives]

according to the way the 1890 tarriff law reads , eng. would not pass muster. england must be spelled out in full,to be shipped to the usa. i have a james rogers bowie, that is pre 1860,which has eng. on the stamping. the country must be spelled out in full after 1890. paris fr. , sheffield eng. ,etc do not comply with the law.

[kam30]

Just looking at the stamp on ine as it's nice to know these things. Mine is stamped XL George Wostenholm Sheffield England. Thing is i cannot see the I, it doesn't appear to have worn off and it is stamped quite clearly. Is this normal?.
Cheers.

[OWDTOM]

Just looking at the stamp on ine as it's nice to know these things. Mine is stamped XL George Wostenholm Sheffield England. Thing is i cannot see the I, it doesn't appear to have worn off and it is stamped quite clearly. Is this normal?.
Cheers.

Not normal no, but not unduly significant.

One of two things could have happened. Either the tang stamp was held slightly off centre when the mark was struck, or more liikely, the cutler may have had to grind off part of the front edge if there was a slight problem when dropping-in the master blade point between the liners. The front edge is the part that runs back from the kick towards the bolsters.

Does your knife have more than one blade and does the letter 'X' sit right up against the front edge of the tang? If not, can you pick out possible remnants of a dot or star to the left of the 'X'
T

[kam30]

Not normal no, but not unduly significant.

One of two things could have happened. Either the tang stamp was held slightly off centre when the mark was struck, or more liikely, the cutler may have had to grind off part of the front edge if there was a slight problem when dropping-in the master blade point between the liners. The front edge is the part that runs back from the kick towards the bolsters.

Does your knife have more than one blade and does the letter 'X' sit right up against the front edge of the tang? If not, can you pick out possible remnants of a dot or star to the left of the 'X'
T

Hi, It is a single blade and the letter X doesn't sit up against the front edge, there seems plenty of room for it. And i can't pick out any star or dot and i got new specs yesterday..
Cheers.

[OWDTOM]

[QUOTE=livinfree;1584619]Not sure if you are refering to my knife. But here are some more photos.


My response related to post #102 by kam30.

Your three-blade sleeveboard whittler is shown, as you suspect, in the 1885 Wostenholm catalogue: in two sizes in fact. It's a very nice knife and well worth a place in any collection.

Most intriguing is the use of an apostrophe in the word Son's, acid etched on the blade flat. Other similarly-etched knives in the catalogue - from what I can see - don't use the '/s.

The picture you have now added of a Wostenholm clip point lock knife is equally intriguing because at first glance it has a Germanic look about it and gives the impression of a style more associated with Solingen than Sheffield - even though the blade is quite clearly marked Wostenholm.

The reason I say this is because of the colour of the fish-tail pommel and the crossguard; the unusual locking mechanism; and the apparent lack of a rivet to hold what would be a 'tumbler' on most Wostenholm lock knives. Another, less important, but not altogether unknown feature, is the spun rather than flush hinge rivet.

It would be very interesting if you could provide a shot of the back spring/blade back area with the knife half open position.
T

[wellington03]

A warm welcome to the forum livinfree.

Thanks for posting pictures of your two knives. Agree with Tom, that "Anglo Saxon" whittler is well worth a place in any collection, a very fine knife indeed.

Only ever seen photo's of these large Wostenholm sleeveboard whittlers, all have the same etch on the blade face with the apostrophe in the word Son's.

The lock-back dirk looks unlike any Wostenholm I've seen, be great if you can provide that extra pic that Tom asks for.

Mick

[sebago]

livinfree,

May I, too, join my illustrious fellow posters "OWDTOM" and "Wellington03," in querying that "I*XL" lockback knife.

Having a fairly long experience of knife collecting, I have NEVER seen this pattern on anything but a knife of Germanic design and manufacture. Over the past 50 plus years, this pattern has not been listed in any Wostenholm catalogue that I have seen.

May I respectfully request if you have any PROOF that Wostenholm of Sheffield, ever offered this pattern knife for sale? If so, may we please see such proof. We, like you, are always keen to learn.

Jim Taylor.